NFP Weighs In On The Vontaze Burfict Debate
If you've been reading the comments on the site for the last few months on any draft related story, you'll no doubt have noticed the debate going on about Arizona State LB Vontaze Burfict. You've no doubt gotten the quick scouting report. He has poor instincts, is not smart and has big character red flags. However.... He's also 6-3, 250, super quick and hits like a ton of bricks.
Wes Bunting, who scouts college for National Football Post, wrote an in depth scouting report on him yesterday which should help give you a better grasp of a guy that I suspect people don't know as much about as they claim. You should certainly read his full report, but here is Bunting's conclusion.
A talent with natural pop on contact, can hold the point of attack and for his size exhibits "plus" range and fluidity. Isn't a guy who I could trust as a starting 43 mike as he needs to stay in control of his emotions and make the defensive calls. Needs to be put in a good locker room with a vet next to him to help him learn to be a professional. If he can overcome his struggles on the field emotionally, he's got the talent to be a Pro Bowl caliber linebacker.
Bunting has him rated as a 6.6 on a scale from 4-9.
He would likely be too much of a reach at #15, as The Sporting News projects him as a 2nd or 3rd round pick. Given the Eagles recent history with 3rd rounders, I'd say why not take a chance on a boom/bust type of guy like this? But what about those higher picks? The Eagles will also pick twice in the second round. Would you roll the dice on this guy with one of those picks?
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What Ever MAN!
They had bad reports on Cam Newton and Tebow too.. Look at them NOW…
by pragit on Jan 13, 2012 10:12 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Not about how they can't control themselves
He’s emotionally out of touch. I’d take him later in the draft but not as our #1 NO WAY!
Newton had slight arrogance concerns, but overall neither of them had character issues has HUGE red flags.
And neither one of them had any concerns whatsoever about on-field effort and control. Those things are the biggest red flags for me.
Clear eyes, full bologna sandwiches!
Neither punched a teammate. Neither was benched by their coach for effort…
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Exactly.
Newton had perceived character concerns because of the pay-for-play accusations and his attitude in some team interviews, but that was really the only discipline based knock on either one of those guys. Burfict has a laundry list of discipline red flags.
Clear eyes, full bologna sandwiches!
Not to mention that Tim Tebow still fucking sucks as a QB.
Formerly... "You don't have to be sweet, to be good"
by Ed Van Chimp on Jan 13, 2012 10:25 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Blasphemer.

AR should have to wear a Flava Flav necklace until he learns how to manage a clock.
I am the proud target of temper tantrums.
So...
Burfict for QB you’re saying?
by ChillBillinChina on Jan 13, 2012 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
He sounds kind of like Ernie Sims…
Let the beasting begin.
by TransplantedFan on Jan 13, 2012 10:20 AM EST reply actions
bigger than sims, slower than sims, but will prob be an equally disappointing bust, like sims.
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I was thinking even a Joe Mays kind of guy ... big hitter but not the brightest bulb in the pack.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
so is bunkley is denver, gocong in cleveland, clemons in seattle, that list goes on…
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I loved Joe Mays ... What was he called, the head basher or something?
They only really used him on special teams and rotated in once in a while.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:44 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah
it’s a shame.
A few years ago we could say a lot of the players Andy cut ties with didn’t go on to be productive in other places. But that has definitely changed in the last couple years. Sheldon and Dawkins have both played well too btw.
hey maybe Dawk will finally get his SB ring this year! HAHA
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
Don't forget
Mikell in St. Louis, and on the other side of the ball, Akers in San Fran
by TColeMonster on Jan 13, 2012 4:35 PM EST up reply actions
Not really.
Joe Mays is supposedly playing well in Denver right now.
Many Bronco fans believe MLB is one of the Broncos’ top needs in the upcoming draft. I like the toughness he brings; but his reads seem remedial.
Truth shall be known.
by Agent Jerry Fletcher on Jan 13, 2012 8:22 PM EST up reply actions
Burfict is the Taylor Mays of the 2012 draft
"If I can get you to think twice, I'm in your head."
-Brian Dawkins
#HireSpags
mays would have been a top 10 pick if he came out after junior year, athleticism was never the problem.
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Stiff hips, poor motion… that;s what everyone said
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i remember hearing 6’3’, 4.3 speed but gets beat too much because he loves the big hit. i guess the hips thing is a function of being tall.
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No. He is a straight line type of guy. Piss poor lateral movement, piss poor coverage skills.
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
If we can get him in the third round, sure, why not?
Any higher and we’d be making a mistake. You don’t bring a player who needs stability and a veteran presence into the black hole that is our linebacker corps.
If we can get Burfict in the 3rd round I say it’s a no brainer. But I think Tulloch and Kuechly together would awesome.
by Almightypudster on Jan 13, 2012 10:36 AM EST up reply actions
I can see the Ravens picking him up in the late first and grooming him under Ray Lewis. Get him some playing time and that kind of leadership. Jimmy Smith had character concerns and look where he went
Yeah the Ravens could draft Burfict in the 1st rd.
by Almightypudster on Jan 13, 2012 10:47 AM EST up reply actions
I knew the, “Ravens can fix any character concerns” point would be brought up eventually.
"Get 'Em"
PSN Username: FlyEagles15....MW3!!!!
by FlyEagles15 on Jan 13, 2012 10:53 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
haha so true
who knew the NFL’s best influence was in baltimore
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Yeah, I heard the Pope just bought a summer home in Baltimore.
Truth shall be known.
by Agent Jerry Fletcher on Jan 13, 2012 8:24 PM EST up reply actions
I’ve watched a lot of burfict as an ASU alum. there is a big difference between taking burfict in the first versus third round. Dont expect this guy to be your savior in the middle of the D. Fix the linebackers with Kuechly/Tulloch, and maybe take a flyer on burfict in the 2nd/3rd round, we do have 2 second round picks. but please Andy, for the love of god, DO NOT tie your LB corps exclusively to the VB wagon.
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Totally agree: Burfict = Flyer
Truth shall be known.
by Agent Jerry Fletcher on Jan 13, 2012 8:25 PM EST up reply actions
A scale from 4-9?
What the hell, that doesn’t make any sense. Did the classic 1-10 scale go out of style?
"Get 'Em"
PSN Username: FlyEagles15....MW3!!!!
by FlyEagles15 on Jan 13, 2012 10:43 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I suppose its still a 1-10 scale, but no college player is perfect, so they cant get a 10 and a player with less then a grade 4 is either an UDFA or will not get any consideration from teams at all
by Anders Jensen on Jan 13, 2012 10:55 AM EST up reply actions
good explanation.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
Ha
I guess that works
"Get 'Em"
PSN Username: FlyEagles15....MW3!!!!
by FlyEagles15 on Jan 13, 2012 11:55 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Just because an MLB points his finger...
…menacingly at the QB, doesn’t mean he’s Ray Lewis.
Truth shall be known.
by Agent Jerry Fletcher on Jan 13, 2012 8:27 PM EST up reply actions
Please pair either Burfict with Tulloch or Tulloch with Kuechly. Give a veteran presence to all of our young LBers and a new stud to go under Tulloch’s wing. I really would feel extremely confident in our defense if we got 2 out of those three, with Tulloch being a necessary target.
Why Tulloch? If we need a veteran LB, it should be London Fletcher. Why? because London Fletcher is many times better then Tulloch.
by Anders Jensen on Jan 13, 2012 10:56 AM EST up reply actions
tulloch just turned 27, fletcher will be 37 by time 2012 season starts. tulloch has played behind a wide-9 as well. it was a no brainer to sign him for this past season (he went for one year 3.25mm), but Andy was too high on casey f’n matthews.
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Tulloch is a liability in the passing game. Tackling machine for sure, but limited otherwise.
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i cant imagine he is as bad as casey matthews. if the eagles sign you, jason, it would be an upgrade to the LBs.
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I’m not syaing Tulloch isn’t an upgrade, he is, but let’s not overrate him.
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No Casey's better in coverage than Tulloch.
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
yea just ask brandon jacobs…casey matthews is terrible bro, take off your eagle goggles
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1 blown assignment?
Tulloch got abused by the Saints.
"you cannot think this 6-foot man is going to survive a full season if defenses have 904 chances to knock his block off"
by EaglesandRavensFan on Jan 13, 2012 6:25 PM EST up reply actions
Haha,
Yeah he had a breakdown in coverage where he didn’t realize who he was covering… Compared to Tulloch literally taking it in the ass by the Saints.
Tulloch’s got 0 cover skills, Casey atleast can cover people when he knows his responsibility.
Plus the issue with Casey wasn’t so much his coverage it was his ability to stop the run.
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
If all things were equal
I’d take Fletcher over Tulloch in a heartbeat. But the age is a huge difference. Tulloch (hypothetically) is in the prime of his career. If we got Tulloch and Burfict in the 3rd that’d be a perfect scenario in my eyes. It really wouldn’t matter who we got in the 1st and 2nd then. Just go BPA.
and if all things were equal
i’ll take dick butkus over all of them
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Tulloch+Burfict would be the “worst” case scenario for me outside of doing nothing. Tulloch isnt really that good and I dont want anything to do with Burfict.
by Anders Jensen on Jan 13, 2012 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
and Fletcher at 37 is still alot better the Tulloch at 27 years, Tulloch isnt a hugh upgrade over what we got and we should be able to draft a better LB in one of the first two rounds then Tulloch.
by Anders Jensen on Jan 13, 2012 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
I'm pretty sure the Lions like Tulloch
and will pay to keep him in the D
Tulloch sucks in coverage... He's awful in it...
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
That's why I said about Burfict
He’s not smart enough to play MLB…. Draft him in the 2nd-3rd round and put him at SAM as a pass-rush specialist. He could be effective as a Suggs-type outside rusher. Just take him out of the game in nickel situations, etc, and he could be effective.
Plus hes a big meanie...
Our LB’s are soft… Rolle,Fletch,Burfict…. might be a pretty mean group
RUN VICK RUN!!!!!!
by DesertEagle59 on Jan 13, 2012 11:08 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I doubt he'll be around if we're looking to nab him in the 3rd,
"If you’re afraid to fail, then you’re probably going to fail. You know what I mean? Fuck it." -- Kobe "Black Mamba" Bryant
Don't want him as #1
But if he’s there for our #2 second round pick I might take a flier on him. Definitely take him if he’s there in the 3rd round. For some reason I don’t see us keeping both of our second round picks this year. AR loves to wheel and deal it seems and I’m thinking one of those 2nd round picks will be going to another team for something.
leaving us again without knowing who we drafted for where ... and more speculation.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
thats funny you say that, one of my good buddies is convinced burfict is too stupid to play LB in the NFL and will be a DE instead.
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More likely outside backer. Either in a 3-4 or 4-3
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I wouldn't rule out
packaging a 1st and 2nd to move up if Andy falls in love with a guy. I’m not sure who that guy would be, but seeing as all signs point to this being an “all-in” (even more than last year) year for Andy, he’s going to need to add immediate talent.
if this happens
who do you think they’d target? i really dont know. assuming jackson is gone i could see moving up for a WR, maybe even a DT if Andy releases patterson, which i think will happen. either way i think i’d rather see us use all of our first three picks.
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If they were to do that ... I would hope its a QB like RGIII
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:43 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah
agree with this. Only problem is that doesn’t fill an immediate need. Andy needs guys that fit in immediately imo (with the early picks).
but with Vick getting older ...
he can mentor RG3 for a year or so before he takes over.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:45 AM EST up reply actions
I think if we can get a guy like Tulloch in FA prior to the draft,
I can see Andy and company trading up our 1 and a 2 for RG3 and taking VB in the 2nd.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
To a team like the Rams who will not be taking a QB in the first ...
That could very well be a worthwhile trade.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
The Rams
will get a better offer from Miami or Washington or another team in need of a QB.
The 15th and 46th (or whatever it is) will not get us up to #2.
maybe Minnesota or Tampa will be willing. They seem ok with their qbs.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
It's a nice idea
But it won’t happen. RG3 is going to be in high demand. There are too many teams in the top 12 that need a QB and there’s only 1 QB available for teams 2-12. The phones for the Rams and Vikings will be ringing off the hook to get their pick.
not only that
but we all saw what happened in the draft last year once QBs started flying. This season has less QB-talent, so expect teams to be even more QB-desperate.
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I personally would rather move up to get blackmon that RGIII
#HireSpags
Come on Andy
Shady McCoy is Still Dirty
Ravens 4 SB '12
Yeah I agree with you
We’re probably better off using all three picks in the 1st and 2nd. I don’t see a guy that jumps out that fits in. If there was a Patrick Willis type LB, I could see us moving up for him. Or if Jackson leaves, maybe move up for Blackmon. But even if Jackson leaves that’s not a huge need. There are some nice OT’s in the top 10, but I don’t see that as a big need. And the DT’s in the draft (as of now) appear to be more in the 15-30 range rather than top 10.
we will probably package our 1st and a 2nd to move up in the top 10 and then...
…take a full back, a TE, something completely ridiculous.
i’m just trying to imagine who the FO will target, because it seems to catch everyone by surprise year after year. I just hope we end up with either Kuechly, Hightower, or Burfict when all is said and done.
by Nathan Mandel on Jan 13, 2012 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
I can see another OT being taken early. Cant be too protective of Vick.
We are good, not that deep.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
that is a legit possibility
even with the starting 5 seemingly set in stone…depth beyond dunlap and justice is lacking. might even wanna think about drafting jason peters heir at LT
by Nathan Mandel on Jan 13, 2012 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
Plus
I know we all love Herremans. He’s been a very good, dependable OL over the years. Probably even an above-average-to-good RT this year, but he’s not elite. Grabbing an elite LT that you could start at RT for a few years would not be out of the question. Then you could move Herremans back to LG if Mathis leaves.
(Disclaimer: This isn’t what I want to see happen. Just something that wouldn’t surprise me if it did happen)
If Kuechly is there at 15
you have to take him. He fits a need and he fits value-wise. The only problem with saying that is because it makes so much sense, it won’t happen. Like you said, we’ll go for someone completely unexpected. Like a 3-4 OLB and try to convert him to a SAM LB or undersized DE.
yeah but what if we actually take Kuechly
…how sweet would that be
by Nathan Mandel on Jan 13, 2012 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
If we do go LB in the 1st I’d go Zach Brown then get Burfict or Hightower in the late first or 2nd. Kuechly won’t solve everything with our LBs
The Legend
Nah
Brown doesn’t jump out at me like Keuchly does. Brown’s more athletic and faster, but Kuechly is the better all-around player. Better tackler/enforcer/run-defender.
Plus, taking Brown at 15 would be a big reach. I’d be find with him later if Kuechly is off the board, but not at 15.
SI has Brown going 9th
"you cannot think this 6-foot man is going to survive a full season if defenses have 904 chances to knock his block off"
by EaglesandRavensFan on Jan 13, 2012 6:43 PM EST up reply actions
And NFP has him ranked as the 6th best OLB in the draft
Whilst I think they’re being a little harsh, I agree with Smitty that he’s probably a reach at 15.
I’d like us to take Keuchly in the first and Travis Lewis in the second. Don’t think Lewis has as much upside as Brown, but I think he’s more consistent.
No, they’re not being harsh. Burfict really is that bad. They’re actually being fairly generous as most of their grade is dependent on some sort of perceived “potential”.
The Curse of Lombardi
Iggles Nest
"Stats are for fantasy and losers. Winning is an attitude."
As you say, the FO never does what we expect them to do
Which is why nobody expects them to make the obvious move and draft Kuechly. Therefore that’s what they’ll do.
That’s sound logic, right?
Well said on draft day we never know what the hell the FO is thinking. And as long as we get Kuechly, Burfict or Hightower it’s all good.
by Almightypudster on Jan 13, 2012 12:08 PM EST up reply actions
BIG MIKE PATTERSON is not going anywhere man.
Patterson had a great year. With Jenkins, Patterson, Dixon and hopefully Landri we have a good DT rotation. I could definately see us drafting a perfect DT for the wide 9 with one of our 2nd rd picks.
I think the perfect LB core would be.
WILL: Brian Rolle
MIKE: Stephen Tulloch
SAM: Luke Kuechly
And we still have two good LB’S in reserve Jamar Chaney and I will say it Casey Matthews.
by Almightypudster on Jan 13, 2012 11:45 AM EST up reply actions
I dont understand ...
Jenkins, Patt, Dix, and Landri … why draft another one … pick one up off waivers or something.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
those are 4 very good DTs
no need to use a high pick on another one this year…maybe next.
by Nathan Mandel on Jan 13, 2012 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
Well we all know ANDY he loves D-Line and O-line picks.
We could get a DT in free agency to help with the four man rotation we have right now. Trevor Laws is gone bye bye. Who knows we could actually for a 3rd straight year draft a safety in the 2nd rd.
I have to admit it scares me that all these early mock drafts have Kuechly going to us at #15. Reid/Roseman never do the norm. I just hope they don’t screw it up. Luke Kuechly has to be our 1st rd pick.
by Almightypudster on Jan 13, 2012 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
i love the LB core you’ve put forward, but disagree on patterson. between jenkins and dixon patterson may be the third best DT on this team, maybe even 4th with the way landri finished out the year. We owe him more than $4mm next year and it wont cost us anything to cut him. consider patterson a goner.
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That would hurt me so much. BIG MIKE played his heart out this year even with the AVM. He is having surgery to repair it and I think he will have another monster year. We should keep Patterson IMO. But we most definately need to resign Landri that is a must.
Another must is resigning Evan Mathis.
by Almightypudster on Jan 13, 2012 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
yes and yes
on mathis and landri. Landri is the new sam rayburn, who was the new paul grasmanis. we always have some white guy wreaking havoc at DT.
dont get me wrong, im no patterson hater. more about the $$ than anything.
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I think the run defense took a big hit when Bunkley was traded and Dixon got hurt. Those 2 guys are ‘clog the middle’ guys, and Patts in the same mold. Getting rid of guys like that can really hurt the middle of the defense, even if you don’t notice them as much on the field as you notice someone like Jenkins.
I would definitely not get rid of Patterson.
Its all about the []_[]
#FirePaulHolmgren
by philiafan14364 on Jan 13, 2012 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
thats my point...
Dixon is your best run stopper, jenkins is your best pass rusher at DT. since only 2 DTs play at a time, it doesnt make much sense to pay your third/fourth best DT $4mm. the eagles will choose either Dixon (RFA) or Patterson (under contract, costs nothing to cut him), and I’d rather have dixon.
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The DTs next year should be, Pats, Dixon, Jenkins, Landri. Thats a really good combination of pass rushing skills and run stopping skills. All 4 of the DTs are good against the run and Dixon have showed good pass rushing skills aswell.
by Anders Jensen on Jan 14, 2012 6:40 AM EST up reply actions
I agree, that’s a great rotation but we have to sign Dixon (rfa). We already paid Jenkins last year and he looks good, so patts could be the odd man out, all I’m saying
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by mpd2005 on Jan 14, 2012 9:13 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
what are you talking about?
Why would Patt be the odd man out?…who would make the team over him?…It’s a 4 man rotation of Jenkins, Patt, Landri, Dixon…if they resign Dixon/Landri. You’re gonna keep Laws over any of those 3?
"Eagles fans are a passionate group who love their team," said McNabb, "if not the actual players. It's not like winning a Super Bowl before the first month of the season is the hardest thing they've ever asked of me. That'd be all those times they asked me to go kill myself."
by greenbean#twoOH on Jan 15, 2012 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
No way, Patterson played very well...
Unless we get atleast a 2nd rounder for him he’s not going anywhere.
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
If we take him in the 3rd, great.
That’s good value at that point. I’d say a second (since we have two) isn’t bad either. But no way should he be our first round pick.
Clear eyes, full bologna sandwiches!
I'd be okay
with him in the 2nd too if they like him that much. Third would definitely be ideal though.
You know...
Tired of all these “supposed” scouts; I bet none of “their” so called picks ever did anything. I would actually value what they’ve said if I had a complete list of their picks 10-15 years solid. If not, then I declare I am a scout and I am on BGN/record: wanted Derrick Morgan or JPP over Graham, Nicks over Maclin, Moreno over McCoy, Jimmy Smith over Watkins. I really only became really interested in the draft 5 years ago…which follows the downward spiral of our team. I also like McShay over Kiper and pull my info from waltercampbell. Remember Cam Newton was ONLY a “system QB”, bad rep ie stealing, cheating/honor code violations AND my personal favorite: scored low on the Wonderlic which measures decision making/QB IQ. EVERYONE makes mistakes Jason…I was wrong about Knowson vs Shady, but I am also 3-1 in drafting. How? A 21 yr old 6"+ press/man corner has WAAAY more upside than a 27 yr guard!! I challenge ANYONE to find someone with a REPUTABLE, verifiable, draft history to put a talent in perspective. I am aware of the Leafs, Russells, Mays, Currys, but I am also aware of the Bradys, Rices, Tramon Williams, Ray Lewis, and Lawrence Taylors too. Hell, I could throw McNabb in, but he has no Super Bowl (unfortunately)! I am on RECORD: Vontaze Burfict. Yes, we need a veteran LB, S; but we would still need both if you drafted college tackling machine, Kuechly. I also am on record: sign Desean to a reasonable contract or part ways. Floyd is decent, but Alshon is BETTER. Pick a WR at 15, then package 2 2nds to Steelers at 24 and take Burfict. I’ve said enough…tired of “so-called” scouts…at least he realizes Burfict is PRO BOWL CALIBER!! They tried the “Golden boy, high character, dare I say limited athleticism” ie Matthews. Time for the “Bad boy, character issue, freakish, athleticism/speciman” surveys says… BURFICT!!
by Lawdhvmercy on Jan 13, 2012 11:53 AM EST via mobile reply actions 1 recs
so you are saying
that if you knew that the birds were going to sign nnamdi and trade for DRC you still like jimmy smith over danny watkins? Danny played well this year and kept getting better. i am intrigued by your idea of taking a WR in the first. lots of talent out there between blackmon, jeffrey, floyd, and the guy from rutgers and baylor. the real question should be which position (LB or WR) will see a bigger drop-off from round 1-2? that is the position we should be using our first rounder on…
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I think
generally elite linebacker talent is gotten in rounds one or two, it is more common to get lucky on later receivers than LBs. Regardless, the Birds (even without DJax) are in better shape at WR than LB, so LB is a better value proposition for them. An impact linebacker, or even a solid starter, would do more for them today than DL or OL depth or another wideout.
That being said, free agency can completely change the needs of the team between now and draft time…
by ChillBillinChina on Jan 13, 2012 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
Actually..
Nmandi hasn’t shown much; yes, he was played out of position. He is also on the wrong side of 30. DRC may have been a good “package deal” as far as raping Arizona. He is young and that is what matters. Jimmy Smith will be decent or above average for 5+ years AND cheaper cost. We will be in same situation with Nmandi like Asanté in 2 years OR less. I don’t fault the “ALL IN” move…it is bold
by Lawdhvmercy on Jan 13, 2012 9:08 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Its hard to take you serious
If you compare Casey Matthews to Luke Kuechly. That’s just silly.
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From now on I will be ignoring anyone who compares Kuechly to Matthews.
It is indicative of someone who is insanely biased or ignorant to reality and it is getting old already.
But first: You think Nicks over Maclin is a win? They are pretty comparable players and I don’t think you can categorically prove one as being better than the other at this point in their careers, so I would call that a tie (making you 2-1-1).
Jimmy Smith over Watkins? With DRC and Nnamdi and Samuel? When the hell was Smith gonna see the field? When would he see it next year even assuming Samuel is gone? Watkins is the better pick considering we got two pro-bowl corners via FA. Not to mention Watkins is a starter at this point while Smith still is not .
And while JPP has clearly worked out, we still can’t say for sure what the better pick was because Graham hasn’t been able to truly prove himself yet (though I suspect JPP will still be the better pick). Looking at the 4 picks you mentioned I would say you are 1-2-1 or 1-1-2 on those 4 picks. Draft picks cannot be judged in a vacuum.
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He posts it
But then never responds to replies. I mean if you’re gonna debate, then debate. But don’t do that I’m always right shit and leave a comment and never come back to it again. Stand up for your argument.
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"Brian Dawkins is always 100% Eagles related."--macjack09 & BGN Nation
Like I said
For every time I read someone calling Kuechly Casey Matthews I’m calling Burfict Aaron Curry.
"truTV is like BET for white folks." - Chuck
"Brian Dawkins is always 100% Eagles related."--macjack09 & BGN Nation
I call shenanigans on the first half of your comment.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by alcatraz0109 on Jan 13, 2012 1:55 PM EST up reply actions
does this mean my investment in "don't vontaze me bro" shirts was a bad one?
But yeah, I agree with nearly everyone else- don’t want him in the 1st, maybe in the 2nd, definitely in the 3rd. I just have too much Ernie Sims aftertaste left to get too excited about him.
I expect us to take a crack at the FA market before the draft, and do plenty of wheelin’ and dealin’ of picks, so all our speculation is especially meaningful. But if we can land a vet linebacker to have him play alongside, sure, take him in the second. If not, probably best to steer clear.
Trying to guess what a team will do is tough. Plan A if we do not get a upgrade for MLB in F/A 45% chance that Luke will be our 1st round pick. 45% chance we make a trade involving our first round pick. 10% chance we stay put and pick someone else (IE some player from the top 10 drops down to 15). I hope if we do not upgrade the MLB position through F/A we do pick Luke. Plan B we upgrade at MLB through F/A . 60% chance we trade up or down with our first round pick. 40% chance we stay put. If we do stay out I would like to see us take who ever is going to help further ensure our pass protection will be solid to very good. The reason I say this is we play the Cowboys, Giants, and Redskins 6 times. Just think of the DE/OLB pass rushers we face, JPP, Justin Tuck, Ryan K. and Brian O. from the redskins, Demarcus Ware, Jay Ratliff from the cowboys.
As far as Vontez goes if he is available late 2nd round or after that I would be fine with that if we pass on him that is fine also.
A lot of people hate on Burfict but I’d be excited if we picked him. I think Andy is in control of the locker room and could keep him from acting out. However, I doubt the coaching ability of our LB and D-coordinator to mold him to his full potential.
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I really do think that the Ravens will jump at him in a heartbeat.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 2:37 PM EST up reply actions
The hard part will be deciding which of our veteran linebackers would mentor the lad. Our LBs are known for leading both on and off the field, how do you pick just one to guide him?
AR should have to wear a Flava Flav necklace until he learns how to manage a clock.
I am the proud target of temper tantrums.
The Problem with Burfict
The problem with Burfict is that I think everyone can agree he isn’t a final product. Like 99% of players in the draft he still has a lot of work to do. When I look at Burfict I see two major problems with the Eagles drafting him.
1. Vontaze Burfict does not fit our current system. What I really think the Eagles need more than anything else is a sure tackling MLB. Burfict just isn’t that, yet. As he is right now he doesn’t fit into the system, and we pretty much need someone who can come in and make an immediate impact.
2. Vontaze Burfict is a too much of an asshole. While this may seem strange, I actually really want the Eagles to have an asshole on the team. As of now the D looks apathetic both on the field and in the locker room. The only guy out there that I actually see get pumped and excited to be on the field is Kurt Coleman. I really think we need an asshole to hype the team up and get them going. The problem is Burfict is too much of one. The Eagles don’t have anyone to give him a veteran presence in the position and i have my doubts about the coaching staff to make the best use of him.
When I look at Burfict I see all the tools to make him one of the next great linebackers in the game. He passionately wants to win, he has the athletic ability to dominate in his position, and he looks like the guy who would scare the opposition. I just doubt the Eagles ability to turn him into that. If we get him with our second 2nd round pick he may be the next Jeremiah Trotter for us. I wouldn’t mind.
First – Ugh! IF we only had Trotter back!!!
Second – We dont need an asshole. We need a leader. Big difference between guys like Haynesworth and guys like Cullen Jenkins.
Third – We dont have a Veteran LB to coach him.
"Obviously, I lobbied for him to be here. But what a difference a year makes." -- Donovan McNabb
by thePurpleLion on Jan 13, 2012 2:55 PM EST up reply actions
"He passionately wants to win"
Uhhh no he doesnt…i cant say it to you guys enough, go watch some ASU tape. talk to any ASU fan and they’ll tell you that burfict has bust written all over him. he got pulled from the last game of the year (as Cal was scoring 45-50 points on ASU), and refused to go back in the game. he spent the rest of the game joking around with the underclassmen that were clearly part of burfict’s entourage.
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Is that the only picture of Burfict that exists?
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one thing about burfict no one talks about...
The guy could never survive the philly media. He was scared sh*tless of the Phoenix media, never did interviews, always refused to talk to the media. with the way some of you criticize reid’s media practices i cant imagine a warm welcome for vontaze.
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My honest opinion of Burfict.
Burfict is a physical specimen who has the athletic ability and talent to be an all-pro LB in the NFL. He has his character concerns, he has his issues and those will likely impact his stock. However there’s no lying that players have straightened out before when brought into a healthy locker room and that’s what Burfict will need.
I’d say take him in the 2nd if he’s there even if we have to trade up from the 3rd to get him. There’s no reason we shouldn’t take a chance on a supremely talented guy at that point where there aren’t many other needs that need to be addressed.
I would honestly love to see us pick Burfict because when he’s actually on he kills it, but sadly he’s off 90% of the time.
I’m still swinging for us to go with Kuechly and Trevathan in the draft, move Trevathan to WILL LB and watch the fireworks.
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
I by no means hate Burfict
If we got him in the early 3rd, maybe even late second, I would be happy. I just can’t stand Kuechly = Matthews, Burfict = Lewis. And then going on to say that because JPP worked out that Burfict will too. JPP never had the character concerns that Burfict does (hitting teammates, ignoring coaches, lack of effort) he was just raw, the only they have in common is physicality.
Yes I completely agree with you.
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
WE DO NOT NEED A WLB.
The Curse of Lombardi
Iggles Nest
"Stats are for fantasy and losers. Winning is an attitude."
I guess it depends whether you rate the guys we've already got at WLB
Maybe W_E is saying the guys we have suck and should be cut; in that instance, drafting a WLB wouldn’t be the end of the world
In that instance, W_E would be wrong.
The Curse of Lombardi
Iggles Nest
"Stats are for fantasy and losers. Winning is an attitude."
The guys we got at WLB?
As of now I don’t think Rolle’s anything more than a filler, Casey needs a ton of room to grow and Clayton’s a joke.
Bring in somebody who can solidify that position for 7-10 years.. Also with Trevathan he’s got the strength to go to SAM if needed.
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
You think that Rolle is a filler because you’re blinded by Trevathan. You see what you want to see.
But I’ll tell you what you should know, Brian Rolle came in as a 6th round rookie, started 13 games and in those 13 games he had 54 tackles, 32 stops, 5 TFL, 1 sack, 3 QB hits, 4 QB pressures, 4 passes defensed and 1 forced fumble. The guy was very clearly our best linebacker this year.
And I know you’re completely biased against Keenan Clayton for some reason but that is your problem, not mine. He doesn’t get consistent playtime but he consistently performs when he gets onto the field. He’s the best cover linebacker we’ve got and all he does is make plays when he hits the field. Last year he made impact plays to help our defense down the stretch and this year he did his time on special teams (where he did very well) until Juan put him in the regular linebacker rotation where he shined yet again. Clayton is a performer and whoever we hire would be wise to put him on the field more often.
Trevathan is 6’ tall and 230 pounds, sorry W_E but that isn’t a strong-side linebacker. That is strictly a WLB.
The Curse of Lombardi
Iggles Nest
"Stats are for fantasy and losers. Winning is an attitude."
See and this is where you're wrong...
You think that Rolle is a filler because you’re blinded by Trevathan. You see what you want to see.
Right there ^ Wrong.
But I’ll tell you what you should know, Brian Rolle came in as a 6th round rookie, started 13 games and in those 13 games he had 54 tackles, 32 stops, 5 TFL, 1 sack, 3 QB hits, 4 QB pressures, 4 passes defensed and 1 forced fumble. The guy was very clearly our best linebacker this year.
See I realize this, but honestly if our best LB is only averaging 4 tackles a game that just shows our entire LB core is pathetic and every position needs to be upgraded…. I have nothing against Rolle, I like the way he plays but he’s unspectacular.
I just think Clayton’s entirely overrated. If he couldn’t get on the field through all the LB struggles the past 2 years on a team with shitty ass LB’s across the board then he simply isn’t that good..
Also watch Danny play, he would instantly be our best LB on the team if he was the only addition we made to our LB core. He lead the SEC in tackles and was a playmaker in college, not to mention that the kid hits like a truck and has the heart and tenacity we’ve been missing since Trotter.
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
Yes we do. We could use an improvement along ALL of the LB positions
and anybody who wouldn’t want to improve every position in the LB core would just simply be stupid.
I know you have a Rolle/Clayton fetish… But honestly I don’t want to bank our future on a dude that honestly has the talent level of a career backup/Nickel LB. And Clayton’s just plain garbage.
I’ll tell you right now. We need improvements at SLB, MLB and WLB and the backups. Honestly the only guys I’d keep from this season are Jordan (ST’s, Versatility), Chaney (Overrated starter but good backup), Matthews (Showed improvement, to high a pick to cut right now) and Rolle (I like him)… But none are starting quality at this point in time.
Fuck if the Eagles went Keuchly, Burfict and Trevathan with their first 3 picks I’d be happy, hell if they got 1 of those guys I’d be happy because at least it’s a potential upgrade over what we have now.
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
I'd say...why not fuck him
We’ve taken enough swings and misses on boom-and-bust prospects. Most of these have turned out to be misses
We need some actual performers
cus we're not gay...?
"Eagles fans are a passionate group who love their team," said McNabb, "if not the actual players. It's not like winning a Super Bowl before the first month of the season is the hardest thing they've ever asked of me. That'd be all those times they asked me to go kill myself."
by greenbean#twoOH on Jan 14, 2012 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/35228/a-couple-of-weekend-links
Dan Graziano included this article in his morning links post.
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