Mel Kiper Regrades The Eagles' 2011 Draft Class
by JasonB on Jan 11, 2012 5:16 PM EST
in Philadelphia Eagles News
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As we know, it's always kind of silly when grades are issued for a draft in the immediate wake of its completion. As much as the draftniks like to think they know, bottom line is that every draft is full surprises that no one saw coming (both ways). Now that the 2011 season over, Mel Kiper revisited his initial grades and re-evaluated the entire 2011 draft. His view on the Eagles draft hasn't changed much.
Old grade = C+
New grade = C
Summary: The Eagles targeted needs, but I didn't think the value was great. Danny Watkins looks like a solid guard after really struggling early in the season, but again, this is a guy you drafted to play guard at No. 22 overall -- there's an expectation that he can be successful early. Jaiquawn Jarrett saw action in 12 games, but I thought he might be the clear starter by this point. Casey Matthews was a reach and saw some time, but he has a ways to go and probably isn't a starting linebacker for a competitive team. Dion Lewis looks like a player who will help this team, but you expect running back value late. The sixth round provided some obvious value. Elsewhere, Alex Henery proved to be a good pick -- he went 24-of-27 on field goals after Philly showed a lot of faith by taking him at No. 120 overall and letting David Akers walk. Not a terrible draft, as some of these guys got experience, but a little light on impact right now.
The "obvious value" he refers to from the 6th round are Jason Kelce & Brian Rolle.
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rolle
next year is he gonna be this years chaney? late round pick who struggled in his 2nd year
i do like rolle though
claude giroux and shady mccoy. the future
The same guy who had more missed tackles than all but four 4-3 outside linebackers despite the fact that Rolle played only 60% of the snaps?
Rolle is a tad overrated.
Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
source?
Trevor Laws: "Thank Giants for kicking to (Desean)."
Mike Vick: "Why would they kick to Desean?"
Matt Dodge: "Snap too high!"
NJ Eagle: "Fly Eagles Fly!!!"
Caplan tosses his salad all the time, and he's normally a stickler for tackling
Trevor Laws: "Thank Giants for kicking to (Desean)."
Mike Vick: "Why would they kick to Desean?"
Matt Dodge: "Snap too high!"
NJ Eagle: "Fly Eagles Fly!!!"
I think for what rolle and definitely kelce did this year
they deserve at least a mention. I hate Kiper because he doesn’t think out of the box at all and he literally is the most stubborn guy ever but at least he’s not Todd McShay.
Trevor Laws: "Thank Giants for kicking to (Desean)."
Mike Vick: "Why would they kick to Desean?"
Matt Dodge: "Snap too high!"
NJ Eagle: "Fly Eagles Fly!!!"
Same. Kiper is usually more accurate, but he’s a total douche.
Formerly DeSean10
36-5-20-JJ -- Forever Bleeding Green
"i was never back on (the Eagles' bandwagon)… they’ll go 8-8 at best and Reid should be fired at the end of the season…. and all you loyalists will be crying your eyes out… and jumping off ledges cuz u didn’t see it coming" - Eagladelphia
MCSHAY is mocked by most of the mock community lol
Trevor Laws: "Thank Giants for kicking to (Desean)."
Mike Vick: "Why would they kick to Desean?"
Matt Dodge: "Snap too high!"
NJ Eagle: "Fly Eagles Fly!!!"
Kyper is an idiot
Mel NEVER gives kudos for discovering guys that missed his radar. The Kelce pick alone was a C… Getting a starting center who is nearly a pro bowler in the late rounds? Now factor in Watkins and you have sealed the holes that were in the eagles offensive line.
Show me ANY OTHER TEAM that gets to starting offensive linemen that look to be pro bowl candidates in their careers our of one draft and he’s scoring A+ on them…
as long as he “called” the picks…
by milroyigglesfan on Jan 12, 2012 1:49 PM EST up reply actions
Kyper has a better track then ANYBODY! I have followed him from the beginning and he is the best draft expert out preforming most GM’s
As for your “any other team that gets a starting O lineman….” – Broncos for one – Orlando Franklin, G. Started every game and is a beast.
Kyper is right about drafting for need. And they fell on their butts. This has been true all too often. I would give the Eagles a D.
by coloradocowboy on Jan 12, 2012 2:56 PM EST up reply actions
Uh… Mel Kiper and all his ESPN schlubs are a bunch of phonies who don’t know what they’re talking about.
See: “I’ll see you at Mike Williams HOF induction”.
And Frankling is actually the Broncos RT and he has actually struggled mightily (lololol and you’re a Colorado Cowboy, you should know).
The Curse of Lombardi
Iggles Nest
"Stats are for fantasy and losers. Winning is an attitude."
Eagles a D based on what?
You say the eagles did not draft for need?
Um.. let’s recap. Need Kicker. Need Punter. Need offensive line help.
Check. Check. Check.
Um.. let’s recap. Need Kicker. Need Punter. Need offensive line help.
Check. Check. Check.The eagles drafted and got how many starters out of the 2011 class? Let’s review. 2 Offensive linemen. 1 kicker. 1 punter. 1 LB.
now how many got significant playing time? 1 safety. 2 more LB’s.
Um.. let’s recap. Need Kicker. Need Punter. Need offensive line help.
Check. Check. Check.The eagles drafted and got how many starters out of the 2011 class? Let’s review. 2 Offensive linemen. 1 kicker. 1 punter. 1 LB.
now how many got significant playing time? 1 safety. 2 more LB’s.The “cowboy” in your name is enough to explain your idiot comments. How can a guy who has NEVER signed a guy to a single NFL contract be considered to “outperform most GM’s”
Um.. let’s recap. Need Kicker. Need Punter. Need offensive line help.
Check. Check. Check.The eagles drafted and got how many starters out of the 2011 class? Let’s review. 2 Offensive linemen. 1 kicker. 1 punter. 1 LB.
now how many got significant playing time? 1 safety. 2 more LB’s.The “cowboy” in your name is enough to explain your idiot comments. How can a guy who has NEVER signed a guy to a single NFL contract be considered to “outperform most GM’s”Do you think he gets a pass as he never has to consider signable , free agency, or team chemistry?
Um.. let’s recap. Need Kicker. Need Punter. Need offensive line help.
Check. Check. Check.The eagles drafted and got how many starters out of the 2011 class? Let’s review. 2 Offensive linemen. 1 kicker. 1 punter. 1 LB.
now how many got significant playing time? 1 safety. 2 more LB’s.The “cowboy” in your name is enough to explain your idiot comments. How can a guy who has NEVER signed a guy to a single NFL contract be considered to “outperform most GM’s”Do you think he gets a pass as he never has to consider signable , free agency, or team chemistry?He’s an architect that never has to build a building, you moron!
by milroyigglesfan on Jan 13, 2012 2:34 PM EST up reply actions
LOL
sorry about the repitition…
computer locked and when I rebooted it seems I repeated same message over and over…
:-P
by milroyigglesfan on Jan 13, 2012 2:37 PM EST up reply actions
Stop with the Kelce nonsense
Just because Baldinger said that Kelce played at a ‘Pro Bowl level’ does not remotely make it so. He was an adequate starter who had his ups and downs this year especially in the run blocking dept where he really struggled in short-yardage situations.
even so
He played at a very high level against some of the better (and bigger) tackles in the NFL. He was without question the most productive rookie for the Eagles this season. And to recap our draft without even mentioning his name is a joke.
What the hell is wrong with you lately? Kelce has been widely recognized for having a solid rookie year by lots of people, including Football Outsiders where he made their all-rookie team over players that were drafted earlier.
Oh and Howard Mudd says he’s pretty good too.
“I know that he hasn’t played against anybody that’s better, I’ll promise you that,” Mudd said of Kelce. "I’ve had the [opportunity] to coach some pretty good ones in the last 20 years. Kevin Mawae, I had him as a rookie. Jeff Saturday, he came out of nowhere. And now this guy comes out of nowhere.
“And they all have the same characteristics. And [Kelce] doesn’t even think like a rookie player when it comes to solving problems. Wow, what a treat that is. Then, when it comes to the mechanical stuff, he performs. Now, am I saying he knocks people down? No, but we don’t have any problems and I’m very high on him.”
Why are you attacking everything you come across lately?
The Curse of Lombardi
Iggles Nest
"Stats are for fantasy and losers. Winning is an attitude."
Yeah he had a solid rookie year or was adequate. If he works on adding a bit more muscle (about 10 pds or so) and really works on building some lower body strength this offseason, he might make the leap next year but saying someone is a Pro Bowler means they are one of the best 2-3 players at their position in the NFL. It is praise that gets thrown around way too commonly.
Pretty fair
Overall the Eagles have pretty mixed impact of there rookies for the 2nd straight year in a row. If this persists next year too despite having 3 decent picks in the 1st/2nd round, the Eagles are once again going to struggle to make the playoffs too & Roseman should be shitc@nned.
Yeah it's fair, and it's doubtful ...
… that with three high picks this year, assuming they use them, they’ll continue their run of crappy luck/evaluation AND not have Graham, Allen or Jarrett round into shape.
They need to nail LB this year, but I have a hard time seeing Roseman canned unless everything goes wrong … again.
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring it Home for Jerome.
by D3Keith on Jan 11, 2012 8:41 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This would have been an ok draft if you were filling depth roles because the majority of your positions were solid & you are coming off a super bowl win / dominant season. Problem was, the eagles werent. They tried filling starting roles with ST / “project” players.
Which has been the case for most of their drafts lately outside of Maclin & McCoy, whom were considered solid picks regardless.
I don't buy your argument
I think you’d have a hard time making a case for knowing that the Eagles were thinking, given that the draft was way before free agency this year. At the time they made those picks, they had quite a few options at linebacker, so I don’t think this really applies:
They tried filling starting roles with ST / "project" players.
Now clearly they gambled at linebacker and it backfired miserably, and maybe they should have had a better plan re: LB for free agency.
But I don’t think you can look at the draft and infer that they intended to get instant starters with any pick other than the Watkins one.
Last year’s major holes were RG and RCB, both of which they filled. Now this year if they willfully ignore LB with their picks, given that free agency will have already occurred, you can rightfully pan their draft strategy.
Last year seemed like a unique occurrence that they planned for, and they as well as most of the rest of us, misjudged the degree to which the young LBs and Ss would hamstring an otherwise solid team.
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring it Home for Jerome.
is it just me or is mel kiper physically unable to say something good about a player without some sort of caveat?
dion lewis played well, but that was to be expected so he doesnt count. wtf? you’re supposed to be grading the draft. was it a good pick or not? don’t give me this ‘its good but its not good’ crap.
you expect running back value late? what? so any team who drafts a rb in rounds 4+ gets no credit for the guy just because its expected to get value there???
From pro football focus
Philadelphia Eagles Center Jason Kelce allowed 33 overall pressures, which is the most by a center in a season over the past three years.
Still I feel he played really well in his rookie season especially evident when Vince young was starting and he was making all the line adjustments for him which just shows A: how smart a center he is and B: how inept a quarterback Vince young is
by Stan11 on Jan 11, 2012 6:28 PM EST via mobile reply actions
wasnt one of the offseason changes for the OL that it requires the line calls to be made by the QB and not the C?
by RogerPodacter on Jan 11, 2012 7:18 PM EST up reply actions
ProFootballFocus is dumb, they’ve seriously got no idea about line-calls, blocking assignments or anything of that sort. They just randomly attributed pressure to Kelce. And what even qualifies as a pressure?
The Curse of Lombardi
Iggles Nest
"Stats are for fantasy and losers. Winning is an attitude."
This is true.
Defensive player of the year for 2011 is...
Wild_Eagle!
Yes, Wild_Eagle's infamous reputation did help him get this award. But he shows that he walks the talk that he serves...with his keyboard. Wild_Eagle protects the motherland (BGN) from the evils of noobs, douche-bags, and other assholes. Although he may be crude and unnecessary, all great defenders draws the yellow flag from time to time.
-Awarded by Number5
Wild_Eagles’ Heart is scarier than Hell, you lose. - d-jackfan10 at the troll known as vicksuck!
It seemed to me with the naked eye that Kelce
was a good center in the run game, when he and the G had to double somebody and then one of them would leave and get the LB. Kelce was good out in space and on run plays, but against bigger NTs and DTs he gave up a lot of pressure.
That INT ret TD against Buffalo was as much on Kelce as it was Vick, IIRC.
In essence, I think it can be both true that Kelce gave up a lot of pressures yet was a pretty good C for an undersized, rookie 6th-round pick
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring it Home for Jerome.
If you can get 2-3 solid players out of the draft, one being pro bowl caliber
it’s a really good draft.
Kelce, Rolle, and Watkins were good pick ups. Kelce and watkins could be really good, I don’t think Rolle will ever be "pro bowl caliber’
He’s right on about Matthrews and JJ though.
JoeD AKA The Voice Of Reason
Yeah it kills me how people can say we're terrible
when a few years ago we nailed two stars, moving up to get Maclin and passing on Moreno, Brown and Beanie Wells and taking the best guy of the bunch at 53 in McCoy, PLUS we had the No. 28 pick that year that we dealt a few days before the draft for Jason Peters.
One of the comments on Philly.com today in the Grigson article was how bad their picks in the first three rounds have been in the past three years. Which includes the Maclin/McCoy year.
People see what they want to see sometimes.
I don’t expect any draft to hit 100%, not even with early round picks. Grab any draft over the past 10 years, and see how many guys panned out. You might get 10-12 stars, 10-12 starters and 10-12 busts in each first round, and even fewer in the later rounds.
I find the draft performance lately to be a little better than middling, but there are enough guys where the jury is still out (Graham, Allen and Jarrett) that could tilt it either way.
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring it Home for Jerome.
by D3Keith on Jan 11, 2012 8:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Give it up with the Kelce “pressures”. The guy gets pushed back a little and they call it a pressure…. without noting his guy did not make the play. Our scheme is not designed to get “push”. It’s designed to get in the way… which is exactly what Kelce does.
The simple fact is… it’s hard to grade Kelce with the rest of the NFL C’s because our scheme is all angles without ever “manning up” up front. A
lls I know is… we were getting destroyed up the middle last year… and this year after the first few games… we did not. Kelce handled Ratliff who has kiiled us. Call it what you want… but Kelce looks very good… and will only get better.
Wish I could take my 40 hour work week, translate that into research, and still be a hack like Kiper.
National writers tick me off. I don’t understand how you can be so wrong, without having a real job to limit your time investment.
I would like to thank my hands for being so great, for allowing me to type this post.
by corn on the kolb on Jan 11, 2012 7:44 PM EST via mobile reply actions 1 recs
My quick ratings for some of the picks After one year
Watkins:C Struggled early on but its was rare to hear his named called by seasons end.
Jarrett:C- Never really got on the field for a significant length of time, which could be seen as not his fault or that he didnt “make” the coaches play him by his showings.
Marsh:C+ Considering only having played the CB spot for two years (at a non powerhouse school), then coming on a team that would add Nnamdi and DRC I feel he showed some promise (just not as a punt returner) with his break on the ball and pass deflection.
Matthews:C Started out terrible but in all honesty probably shouldnt have been placed as a starting LB let alone a MLB in the first place. By seasons end though he was making “hits” on the field as oppose to making tackles (Hits to me mean that a player made a great read on a play that lead to him making a big/hard tackle with the ball holder unable to make an offensive move)
Henery:B Consistent Kicker that will be here for years to come, also displays a “Manning like” persona where he rarely seems stumped or shaken.
Lewis:C Terrible Kick returner, probably the worst since R.Mahe but did show an ability to make quick and sudden cuts that would lend to success on this level. As far as cant miss back-up, not sure how I would feel about him being a #1 for a small stretch if Shady went down.
Kelce:B+, I don’t think he had a “Pro-Bowl” year but I do think he will be our starting center for upwards of the next decade. Now, he MUST get stronger, that is his main problem going into the offseason but if I would have been told that a 6 round rookie Center was going to be our starter I would have never believed it. Great Value and probably will go down as the best pick from this draft other than the Kicker.
Rolle:B Greatly surpassed my expectations this year in a year where he could be considered one of our top 2 best LB’s. Needs to get stronger also, but he has shown the ability to get around blocks that bigger LB’s wouldnt be able to get around or fit into spaces that Bigger LBs cannot get to. He has an explosive closing burst in Pass Coverage and can be used to blitz the QB, all in all I think this was a solid pick up and he could maybe be a full time starter.
Lloyd: To be decided
Havili (sp): To be decided
ok, the giants suck.
by BigBlueIntervention on Oct 4th
Fair, but I'd go more like
Watkins: B
Drafted to start and held down the job for 12 games. Given that he had no camp, that’s pretty good, but still not worthy of an A.
Jarrett, Marsh, Matthews: Incomplete, Incomplete, D.
None of these guys should have been expected to start right away. I think it’s early to really definitively grade Jarrett or Marsh, because they didn’t contribute. At the same time, it’s also probably bad drafting to take guys at 2, 3 and 4 that you know you shouldn’t be expecting much out of.
They expected too much out of Matthews too soon. If one were to judge him just on his late-season contributions, then he might get a good grade. But that Brandon Jacobs debacle in the first Giants game kills any good grade I want to give him.
Henery: A.
We’ll look back in 5 years after Akers is no longer setting field goal records and is out of football as a brilliant pick. Need to see him be clutch in Year 2 though; I still blame the 49ers loss mostly on him.
Lewis: B
Looks like he could be the No. 2 RB as soon as next year, but really shouldn’t be returning kicks.
Rolle & Kelce: A-, A
Great to get starters in the 6th round. A high percentage of 6th rounders are probably out of the league, if not immediately, in a year or two. Both show promise going forward, although Rolle might be better suited as a bit-part player than a starter.
Lloyd: Inc.
Was prime candidate from Day 1 for eagles’ annual phantom preseason injury. No surprise he never played.
Havili: F.
I know it was a 7th rounder but if you don’t get out of camp it wasn’t a good pick.
Lloyd.
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring it Home for Jerome.
C is a little low.
I think that a grade of C is a bit too low. Now,..admittedly, we didn’t draft any future HOF’rs, but maybe some future Pro Bowlers’. So, yes we didn’t draft any immediate super stars, but we did get 4 starters! Let me repeat, 4 starters. Watkins, Kelce, Rolle, and Henry.
In a draft teams can address needs , depth, or immediate impact. We got all three from this draft class. So while none of the players we drafted are big name ROY candidates, we did get a couple solid starters, a couple of young lineman that should be side by side for years, and a kicker that should be in place for years as well.
So there are a couple different ways of viewing this draft class, I’d argue that getting 4 first year starters as a successful draft worthy of a grade higher than a C.
"I'm not a cowboy, Pam... I'm a stuntman." - Stuntman Mike
"Obviously you're not a golfer." - The Dude
Kuechly AND Burfict
Would it be possible to draft both…Kuechly at 15 and package BOTH 2nds to pick up/before Steelers at 24; definitely before the Ravens at 24? I am slightly warming up to Kuechly, but I definitely want Burfict
by Lawdhvmercy on Jan 11, 2012 10:39 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Oops...
Ravens at 29. Ravens feel Burfict the next Ray Lewis clone. I want him in Eagle green
by Lawdhvmercy on Jan 11, 2012 10:40 PM EST via mobile reply actions
burflict will be a bust
luke or bust in round, maybe the unc (brown I think)
guy round two
by ytylerdurden on Jan 11, 2012 11:36 PM EST via mobile reply actions
luke or nobody round 1,
stupid android
by ytylerdurden on Jan 11, 2012 11:37 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I agree we need to draft Kuechly in rd 1.
Maybe our first 2nd rd pick could be a good DT to fit Washburn’s scheme maybe someone like Brandon Thompson, DT, Clemson if he is still available.
by Almightypudster on Jan 12, 2012 11:56 AM EST up reply actions
NFL Players are in a significant high power level through developments....
Kuechly is great at the highest college level, if we do take him in the 1st round, he can develop instinctively into the next level. He’d probably be pitch into the rotation when the season start, as an evaluation to plant down his strengths, normally can’t be seen in the full off season. They need to train him to make big hits to accommodate his inside play style, such as bulldozing a blocker and instinctively reach in and drag down the ball carrier. If he’s available, which way are they going in the 1st round? Whatever the reasons, there are too many things to consider.
by EaglesHeat on Jan 12, 2012 1:07 AM EST via Android app reply actions
Defensive Drafts
Have been a complete joke since 2002 yet no one has been held accountable. What does that tell you?
by AndyReidsPersonalAntagonist on Jan 12, 2012 10:12 AM EST reply actions
I for one want to see Jarrett on the field more next season. Coleman kinda looks iffy to me and I don’t think is starting material but a serviceable backup.
Nobody in football should be called a genius. A genius is a guy like Norman Einstein.
- Joe Theismann
by FloridaEagle on Jan 12, 2012 11:31 AM EST via Android app reply actions
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