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You don't have to hate Kolb to root for Vick
by D3Keith on Sep 23, 2010 2:57 PM EDT
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Print[Note by JimmyK, 09/23/10 3:02 PM EDT ] - Here's a guest post by BGN member D3Keith, which is too sane not to put on the front page...
Here's a little refresher for all our fellow fans:
When the Cowboys and Eagles play, you have to pick a side. When the Eagles are deciding who to start at quarterback, you don't.
Because we're all on the same team. If this sounds simplistic, it's because it is; but it never hurts to hear. As we learned here on BGN not too long ago, sometimes we're grown men posting alongside 10-year-olds. Some of us are teenagers, some just have the emotional capacity of one.
No matter where you stand, I'd like to make perfectly clear that none of us has to be labeled Pro-Kolb or Pro-Vick. Stunningly, some of us can see the merits of either guy. Some of us prefer one to the other; most of us just wish it had been handled differently, or we'd seen it coming.
Wondering what the future holds for Kevin Kolb -- as if we could possibly know after a half against the Ravens, games against the Saints and Chiefs, a preseason and a weird half against the Packers -- is mostly unrelated to Michael Vick. Not many true Eagles fans want to see Vick fail.
At the same time, because the future of Kolb has been this long, mysterious wait for answers, and because it appears we might not be getting them anytime soon, our frustration is reasonable. Still, our excitement for Vick is palpable.
Let me share a weird concept:
I think Michael Vick is supertalented. I much prefer having him on the Eagles than not.
I think Kevin Kolb is likable, and I'm intrigued by his potential. There's no way I can know what he'll become, but I am still eager to find out.
I still believe in Donovan McNabb, though the more he talks, the less I miss him.
In other words, I don't hate any of these guys. I don't think any of them suck. I'd much rather be choosing between Kolb and Vick and make the wrong choice, whatever that is, than make the right choice out of Trent Edwards and Ryan Fitzpatrick or Jason Campbell and Bruce Gradkowski.
I imagine I'm not alone in being a fan of both Michael Vick and Kevin Kolb. If you are too, show those who would divide us how we roll, with the rec button. I'm rooting for both to succeed, because ultimately, the better they do, the better the Eagles do.
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That's great Bobby, but we don't have Dance Dance Revolution, so... you're dumb.
by alcatraz0109 on Sep 23, 2010 3:11 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
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by JasonB on Sep 23, 2010 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
ahhh, the golden child.
total classic.
"it's like i tell my ex-wife, i never drive faster than i can see, and besides it's all in the reflexes." -Jack Burton, Big trouble in little China
That also kinda looks like the bad guy from Last Action Hero. Schwarzenegger at his finest.
by PF_Flyers22 on Sep 26, 2010 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Amen!
We like the drama and the debate, but in the end we want to win! I have no idea what this will mean for the long term future of the Eagles but I see where the combo of Kolb’s struggles (through pre-season and the GB half) , offesnsive line instability, and Mike Vick’s athleticism / newly honed QB skills gives us the best chance on offense.
Does anybody have any answers for the D though? That’s who really worries me!
Love the Citizen Kane clip alcatraz!
Nice turn of phrase
I actually used “game recognize game” to explain to a friend why Kolb hasn’t “lost the locker room.” if he plays well the next few times he gets a shot and the Eagles win, the Young Guns will still love him.
Secretary of State for BGN aka "Most diplomatic man on this site," as appointed by Talon Talent
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring It Home For Jerome
<img src=“”http://photobucket.com/images/animated%20clapping" target="_blank">
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by macjack09 on Sep 23, 2010 3:24 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Whoa, Whoa, Whoa....
D3Keith, what the hell are you doing with this post. Are you outta you’re mind? No logic, stop that.
And Jimmy, you should be ashamed of yourself. Supporting someone with ideas like this. What next? One man one vote? Women’s sufferage? What kind of world would that be?
"If it bleeds, we can kill it" -Dutch
"Men are clinging to football on a level we aren't even aware of. For centuries, we ruled everything, and now, in the last ten minutes, there are all these incursions by women. It's our Alamo."
-Tony Kornheiser
The real question here is...
Can we still hate Jason Peters?
Man does that guy piss me of sometimes.
"THIS IS NOT COLLEGE NO MORE. THIS IS THE BIG MAN SPORT." ~Crazy Lady on BGN forums
Yes.
Asante Samuel’s tackling is also still in play. (Loves contact, hates wrapping up!?!?)
Secretary of State for BGN aka "Most diplomatic man on this site," as appointed by Talon Talent
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring It Home For Jerome
Clearly,
the man needs Brian Dawkins to help over the top.
Maybe Koa Misi and Jared Odrick would be Patriots if Bill Parcells wasn't Comedic.Sans's father...
"I looked at BN once. I got banned." -the immortal words of JShufelt
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Sep 25, 2010 3:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Bravo sir.
I’m glad I could in some way inspire you to craft a worthwhile and level-headed post such as this. All I want is what’s best for the Eagles. And I do not hate either player, I simply have opinions on or about each.
Nicely done.
Fuck the Cowboys.
Hey! I thought I edited your quote in there
about a lot of people taking out anger at Kolb for things he had no control over. And then I added something to the effect of a lot of us making unsupported claims of future success/failure for both guys.
I guess I either didn’t save it properly, or the first version had already hit the big time when I went in to add the next one.
Anyway, you all got the point.
Secretary of State for BGN aka "Most diplomatic man on this site," as appointed by Talon Talent
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring It Home For Jerome
Well done.
Agree with you 100%. I support the Eagles. I support Kolb. I support Vick. I don’t like the decision as I think its short sighted and flat out wrong but I will certainly continue to root for this team every Sunday regardless.
5-8-10...the day the Purdue Boilermakers basketball team won the 2011 NCAA Championship!!
wow
So glad to see all the posts are clapping, becauae before I even panned down on my BB, I wanted to break out clapping when I read:
“I still believe in Donovan McNabb, though the more he talks, the less I miss him. "
Overall this article deserves a Rec (once I can figure out to do it mobile-ly). I’d like to considerate myself a Moderate in the debate – I’m a fan of winning, nothing more.
by RucanorX on Sep 23, 2010 3:40 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
I agree completely. I don’t love the move right now, but I will root hard for the Eagles this Sunday and continue to support the team.
by JoshuaR on Sep 23, 2010 4:03 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
I try not to post too much....
I couldnt agree with you more, i really dont care who is in the backfield slinging the ball so long as it brings a win on sunday. Al Davis got one thing right when he said “Just win baby”.
Thank YOU
Exactly my feelings on the entire matter. Rooting for either to fail so someone can be “right” in the end wins us nothing—certainly not a SB title.
Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.
My Feelings Exactly
EncoreEncoreEncore
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
This BLOG title is B.S
Nobody hates Kolb. We just believe he sucks and we don’t want to spend a season to rebuild 1 player when the rest of the team doesn’t need to be rebuilt.
If anything the title should read.. YOU DON’T HAVE TO HATE VICK TO WANT KOLB TO HAVE A CHANCE! How is it not HATEFUL to see a man play amazingly for YOUR favorite team, but still say, “I don’t want him in the game”.
Vick plays 1 and a half games and he looks great. But instead of CHEERING for the team. I see and hear more people saying how VICKS great play won’t last. Or.. Vick has to win the superbowl if he starts. There is no reason to not be happy that we have a QB that looks better than every other QB in the league right now.
I was fully behind Kolb after he lit up the saints and the cheifs. I’m sure that why a lot of people believe in Kolb is because of his performance from those 2 games.
The hate we all see is going towards Vick.
HOW DOES A MAN PUT UP NUMBERS LIKE VICK PUT UP. and the fans still feel sorry for the guy who hasn’t done anything?
Where did this Kolb fanclub come from.. I’ve even seen comments that said, “win or lose we need to let Kolb play a full season to see what he can become”.. People are willing to throw the season away in order to help Kolb become better.
You kolb fans would rather WASTE a season in hopes that Kolb can play half as good as Vick played in the last 2 games..
yea.. makes perfect sense!
yea.. makes perfect sense!If I was Vick.. I would demand a trade.. and I hope if the eagles decide to develop for the sake of 1 player.. that D jackson leaves too.. He and the rest of the team doesn’t deserve to put their careers on hold for kolbs HOPE OF BECOMING JOE MONTANA
yea.. makes perfect sense!If I was Vick.. I would demand a trade.. and I hope if the eagles decide to develop for the sake of 1 player.. that D jackson leaves too.. He and the rest of the team doesn’t deserve to put their careers on hold for kolbs HOPE OF BECOMING JOE MONTANA
yea.. makes perfect sense!If I was Vick.. I would demand a trade.. and I hope if the eagles decide to develop for the sake of 1 player.. that D jackson leaves too.. He and the rest of the team doesn’t deserve to put their careers on hold for kolbs HOPE OF BECOMING JOE MONTANA
People who react the way you just did are the reason this post was written. Please find your Xanax and take it before you hurt someone.
Got rational behavior? ...apparently not.
36-5-20-JJ Bleeding Green Forever
by DeSean10 on Sep 23, 2010 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
people who react to a post that made sense but respond with nothing that gives what you say any value are usually.. (as Einstein would say)!!! overawed, apprehensive, nervous, alarmed, terrified, browbeaten.. or in easier words.. Flat out Intimidated because you KNOW IM RIGHT!!
by phillyisback on Sep 23, 2010 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions
please calm down
it was only a game and a half. while I hope Vick continues to beat up on everyone he faces, I feel we, as fans, need to temper expectations for both qbs.
I know you probably dismiss the “didn’t gameplan” thing for Green Bay, but they only had 2 active DTs that game, and one got injured – surely that’d be different if Vick was the official starter. And Detroit, is well, Detroit. Here are some selected starting QB stats against the Lions the last 2 seasons (from deadspin):
J.T. O’Sullivan. 189 Yds, 2 TDs, 0 Ints.
Gus Frerotte. 296 Yds, 1 TD, 1 Int.
Jason Campbell. 328 Yds, 1 TD, 0 Ints.
David Garrard. 238 Yds, 2 TDs, 0 Ints.
Jeff Garcia. 165 Yds, 2 TDs, 0 Ints.
Aaron Rodgers. 308 Yds, 3 TDs, 0 Ints.
Drew Brees. 358 Yds, 6 TDs, 1 Int.
Jason Campbell. 340 Yds, 2 TDs, 1 Int.
Matt Hasselbeck. 329 Yds, 1 TD, 1 Int.
Brady Quinn. 304 Yds, 4 TDs, 0 Ints.
Joe Flacco. 230 Yds, 1 TD, 0 Ints.
Alex Smith. 230 Yds, 1 TD, 0 Ints.
Michael Vick. 284 Yds, 2 TDs, 0 Ints.
Now I’m now saying Vick sucks, but when Brady Quinn puts up 304 and 4tds, maybe we shouldn’t anoint Vick the savior because of the “numbers he put up”
by prnandhomeless on Sep 23, 2010 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions
i meant to take out brees and rodgers too, because they should play like that
by prnandhomeless on Sep 23, 2010 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions
LOL @ Brady Quinn
Just because he’s Brady Quinn
thats what caught my eye too
holy shit marsha brady fucked them up lol
I'm BadCo'09 and I approve this message.
I was fully behind Kolb after he lit up the saints and the cheifs.
Can I ask what changed for you? You now believe he sucked. Why? Is it more that you liked what you saw from Vick more? Because that’s fine, but it’s different than Kolb sucking. And if you were so quick to give up on Kolb, what will you do when Vick has a bad game?
It seems to me you are very reactionary. Big numbers means hand them the keys. It was Kolb after his two games last year, but now Vick is the big number flavor of the week so you jump to his ship. I also love that you wish the Eagles ill if they choose to start Kolb. That shows real maturity and loyalty as a fan.
by NOLACuse on Sep 23, 2010 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
It’s not like I’m cheering for Vick to be amazing and Kolb to suck.
If Vick played terrible no one would even want him on the team. If Kolb played terrible everyone would use the excuse that he needs to develop and give him the pass..
What changed is that we have a better QB now..
Something doesn’t add up when:
- Kolb supporters want Kolb to start regardless of if it means we’ll have a losing season with him. But the same people also say that if Vick starts he MUST WIN THE SUPERBOWL! thats pure HATE! when if Vick plays HE BETTER WIN IT ALL.. but if Kolb plays he has the green light to lose.
The bottom line is this!
The arguments for Kolb to start are the WORSE!!!! Ohh.. Reid said he was starting and it’s not fair.. its NOT FAIR to bench him and play with his feelings.. We have to let him develop and get experience.. WHY???? This is the NFL.. This football..
The argument for Vick to start is simply. .. HE LOOKED GREAT!!!!
if everybody on the team was given a starting position for the same reason Kolb was.. We would be the worse team in the history of the sport..
ohhhh its not fairrrrrrrr.. You cant do that to Kolbs feelings.. LMAO!!!!! maybe we should feel sorry for every player that plays their heart out and gets CUT FROM THE TEAM..
FYI.. KOLB IS MAKING MORE MONEY THAN DESEAN JACKSON… and what has Kolb done compared to Jackson?
by phillyisback on Sep 23, 2010 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions
It's not hate on Vick.
It’s questioning the decision of Reid. With the contract situation the way it is Vick is only here one year. If he doesn’t get an extension and we still start him, that means the Eagles are all-in to win now. Period. If Vick leaves and we didn’t win the Super Bowl or at least do well in the playoffs, what was the point? I’m not holding Vick accountable for the season; I’m holding Andy Reid accountable for the season. Vick hasn’t done a thing wrong in my opinion. He has simply stepped up and played great. I don’t blame him for seizing the opportunity. I blame Reid for bungling the situation.
-“better qb now(you)” NOW is the important word. Kolb hasn’t had a chance to develop.
-Kolb need s to develop(this will be recurring point) look up Peyton Mannings, Brees, Rogers and McNabbs first seasons. They struggled and so did their teams.
-Kolb is a QB. QB’s make more than WR’s.
-Fair? Who cares about fair? Fair is what loser hold on to when they lose and need an excuse. Again look up the best QB’s and see how they struggled in their first and more years or so.
You’re short sighted. Nothing great comes easy son. Vick will win more games this year. He is way WAY more fun to watch. He will never be good enough to win a SB game. The proof is in the pudding. Remember when we faced him in the PO’s? We adjusted our defense to make him stay in the pocket and assigned a spy on him.We kept our DE’s on contain and blitzed up the middle and crushed him. Brains win. Peyton, Brees, Brady Rogers all know what their doing before the snap. They move people to dissect the defense before the snap. Vick just relies on his athleticism. We’re not talking even close to the same caliber QB’s. PManning> Vick.
by Darth Banner on Sep 24, 2010 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Not saying Kolb will ever be great
just saying all great qb’s took time to catch up to the mental part of the game.
by Darth Banner on Sep 24, 2010 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions
You nailed it, Keith
I just have one question – if you had written it the other way, “You don’t have to hate Vick to feel Kolb got shafted”, would this post have gotten the same enthusiastic reception? I’d like to think so but I’m not too sure.
Vick did a great job and I’m ready to support him. After all, I’m not the guy who puts the players on the field, so there’s a limit to how much my opinions matter.
By the way, last year you didn’t have to hate McNabb to feel it was time to take a chance on Kolb.
Just like you don’t have to hate Shady to be happy that Joique Bell got signed.
We’re fans of the Eagles team – that’s bigger than support for any one player.
"Verde que te quiero verde..."
Το πράσινο είναι ζωή!
That's right, I bleed green multiculturally
"if you shut someone down with class, it's more effective" - Udalango
I have to be honest here, but with all due respect to D3Keith, I will never root for Michael Vick. Not because of anything that happened to Kolb, but because I basically do hate Michael Vick. I thought he was a lousy human being before the dogfighting conviction, which lowered my opinion further. (This was mostly related to the “Ron Mexico” incident, which was quietly settled out of court. I have trouble believing he would have settled out of court if he was not at fault.)
So yeah. Vick gets no respect from me, but I’ll be rooting for the other 52 on Sunday.
I've got no gripe with people who've got their reasons ...
… for not liking Vick. I don’t share the views, but I can respect that they’re rooted in something. Like a Libertarian.
The post was in response to those posting who decided anyone eager to figure out the Kolb mystery must be in love with him because he’s white and/or have him penciled in to be the next Montana, while also harboring deep-seeded ill will for Vick.
There were definitely people posting like it never dawned on them that you could have been eager to see what Kolb could do and also drooling in anticipation at Vick’s potential.
Secretary of State for BGN aka "Most diplomatic man on this site," as appointed by Talon Talent
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring It Home For Jerome
Right now.. it looks like this…..
Kolb = Lets test this guy out.. He looks good in practice and hopefully in the future he will be a great player.. We still don’t know yet though..
Vick = WOW!!!! This guy is looking Amazing! did he just do that!
Now which guy would you start? Excluding the rebuilding season theory because the team is not in need of rebuilding.. Only Kolb is..
by phillyisback on Sep 23, 2010 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions
In a vacuum that's absolutely true.
But the contract situation muddies the picture. There is a possibility that Reid truly believes Kolb is the future. So he intends on keeping him and starting him next year. He is playing Vick only because Vick has done so well and Reid fully expects that Vick will be gone next year. That is a distinct possibility.
My fear is this: Kolb might be terrible. He might not be a starting caliber QB at all. We don’t know yet if this is the case. If Vick leaves next year, only for us to find out that Kolb can’t carry the offense, what happens? We would have passed up a golden opportunity to maximize our talented young team.
I am concerned about longevity and sustained success for this team just as much as I am concerned with winning right now. I don’t want to see the Eagles become mediocre and miss the playoffs for 4-5 straight years just so that we can make a Super Bowl-less playoff run this year. Ideally, I want both a playoff run this year and playoff runs every year after that. But I am very much concerned about the long-term viability of the Eagles. I believe sustained success gives us the best chance to win a Super Bowl. And a Super Bowl is the real goal.
I am confused.
Because I don’t hate Kolb. But I do hate Vick. That’s someting I’ll have to work out on my own, I guess.
I have to take exception with your last sentence and your, “the better they do, the better the Eagles do.” The “they” in this case is Kolb and Vick. But only of them is going to last Andy’s great QB purge of 2010. I would be stunned if Kolb is not demanding a trade from fatandy at this very minute. How can he be happy with this situation? If he is as much of a competitor as his hog-slaying would indicate (and his Texan roots would insist upon), he probably feels completely fucked over. So I guess it’s time to sign Vick to a huge contract extension?
"Up yours, asshole!"--EvilBanner to effeminate yachtsman Boston Jeff Lurie
As to the “the better they do” quote, isn’t it possible that Vick doing well now and Kolb continuing to progress and do well in the future would be the most beneficial thing for this team? Believe me, I think Kolb got shafted even though I don’t think he’s our answer at QB. He should have been given his shot, but you can’t root against Vick at this point; it would be akin to rooting against the Eagles.
Got rational behavior? ...apparently not.
36-5-20-JJ Bleeding Green Forever
EvilBanner, I specifically edited this for you ...
… from “no true Eagles fan …” to
Not many true Eagles fans want to see Vick fail.
I recognize that some people hate Vick for the man he is, and if there is some way he could fail and not cost the Eagles a victory, you’d take that in a second.
As far as
"the better they do, the better the Eagles do."
I didn’t want to make the post itself any longer, but mostly I mean I think they might both have to play at some point, and I’m not actively rooting for Kolb to pout (which to his credit he seems not to be doing) and then not be ready when his number is suddenly called.
Also just mean it in a basic sense, that if we do give up one one guy or the other, but there’s an opportunity to get something for one of them, you want him to play as well as possible in whatever looks he gets to increase his value.
So even Eagles fans who despise Vick have an interest in him playing well. If he lights it up he may opt not to re-sign and let a bidding war ensue.
Also, I don’t like being one injury away from the season being shot at any position (we’re probably there at RB already), but especially QB. I think it always behooves teams with playoff aspirations to carry at least two quarterbacks who can play if needed, even if at a high cost.
Given that Kolb is 25, I don’t know that one high pick would be enough for him, as any deal involving him would require us to burn a high pick later to acquire another QB prospect … so for me he stays put as long as we can hang on to him.
Secretary of State for BGN aka "Most diplomatic man on this site," as appointed by Talon Talent
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring It Home For Jerome
You have described my ideal Eagles win.
21-0 victory with a Jackson punt return for a touchdown, Asante taking one to the house and Shady scoring (thank God he seems to have gotten over his dancing fever).
Your post was good. I liked it. But as a man who owns a Jaworski jersey for Christ’s sake, I have to take exception to the direction Andy has chosen to go with this one.
I just don’t see how Roseman and the beancounters get out of this one without trading Kolb.
"Up yours, asshole!"--EvilBanner to effeminate yachtsman Boston Jeff Lurie
YOU HATE VICK!!!??? racist!!!
You hate Vick..
But you don’t hate every man and woman who joins the Army. They get paid to go over seas and murder anybody including women and children.. They even showed the U.S bombing Iraq and the aftermath on the NEWS..
Thats like saying.. It’s OK to kill Deer, Moose, Bear, Bobcats, etc… To stuff them and hang their heads on your office wall.. But it’s soooooooo terrible that Vick allegedly shot a dog…
What about the people who Kill horses because they break their leg and can’t race to make their owners money anymore? THATS OK too right..
You can kill women and children.. You can kill all other animals for sport and hang their heads on the wall.. You can kill your horse that breaks its leg.. thats perfectly OK.. but Vick is a terrible person..
THAT MAKES PERFECT SENSE IN AMERICA!!!
by phillyisback on Sep 23, 2010 10:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Race card, comparing Vick to military soldiers, completely dissing America…
Man, you are a jackass.
RIP Jim Johnson, best ever.
If you people or had family who were murdered.. You would look at life totally different..
besides that.. I stated FACTS..
The bottom line is that soldiers REALLY KILL PEOPLE!
I’ll be a jackass.. And I won’t even bother calling you any stupid names over the internet..
by phillyisback on Sep 24, 2010 12:04 AM EDT up reply actions
I know. Someone hating Vick making them a racist? Total fact. /sarcasm
Yes, soldiers really kill people…people that would kill us given the chance. You know, Al-Quada and such. Why do you think there was an invasion of Afganistan in the first place? It was the location of where the people that cause 9/11 were at. Besides, soldiers are the one given up their lives to protect their country. Don’t care who you are, give them a little more respect.
Not to mention Vick didn’t just shot dogs, he tortured them. Fight to the death, drowning them, electrocuting, hanging, and shooting them. There isn’t a comparison; senseless killing dogs vs protecting our country.
RIP Jim Johnson, best ever.
location of where the people that cause 9/11 were at
you can’t possibly believe that? The people that caused 9/11 were at 1900 Pennsylvania BLVD but that’s for another day and another thread.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
by eaglelover1 on Sep 24, 2010 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions
sadly i dont believe so
but lets keep politics and conspiracy theories off this board, this is for football son
I'm BadCo'09 and I approve this message.
I see
You know absolutely nothing about horses…
You’re right.. I don’t.. But I know they do put horses to sleep… or .. easier said.. KILL THEM..
And I know that since it was clearly impossible for you to debate anything that I stated. You simply said the only thing you could say in return that would make yourself feel as if you didn’t give in to the absolute truth!!!
I don’t even think I would want to cheer for the game with you people..
by phillyisback on Sep 24, 2010 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions
But do you know
WHY they kill horses with a broken leg? I’ll give you a hint: It’s not, as you say, because they’re no longer money makers. The internet is a great thing, I’m sure google can tell you more.
The reason I seized upon that point is because, quite simply, while I felt that most of your post was due to ignorance, I wanted to point out to you one of the many incorrect statements you made. However, you chose to react in that way, which is telling. As said above, this post is made for people like you, and it’s sad that you don’t seem to “get” it.
Wow, dude. Seriously?
I’m about as liberal as they come, and I still think you’re an asshole for saying US troops just indiscriminately kill everything. Then you say it’s because all Americans are hypocritical or something? If you hate the country so much, you can leave.
Also, I hope you’re joking with the racist stuff.
I don’t usually get into name-calling or stuff like that, but Imp is right.
R.I.P. JJ (7/28/09)
by Carolina Iggle on Sep 23, 2010 11:12 PM EDT up reply actions
I didn’t say US troops kill everything.. All Soldiers in all countries KILL PEOPLE..
It’s sad but there is no way around it.. They really Kill PEOPLE!!!
I guess you and these other peoples believes that it’s JUSTIFIABLE to KILL “PEOPLE” as long as it’s troops who do the killing..
LMAO!!! I love how you guys are just leaving out the people who hunt animals for sport and hang their heads on walls..
let me guess.. Thats OK too.. and I’m a jackass for comparing killing a dog to killing defenseless wild animals for sport.. It’s ok for KOLB TO KILL WILD PIGS FOR NO REASON THOUGH!!!!!
and dont get me wrong.. I don’t have a problem with people who hunt for sport.. I just call how it is.. How is it OK for them.. But Vick is a unforgivable evil convict..
ohh thats right.. the way you guys are responding.. this makes perfect sense.. everywhere.
by phillyisback on Sep 24, 2010 12:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Okay I am going to respond very calmly even though the rage I feel inside right now is actually causing me to overheat.
Sport Hunting as you call it is used as a means to control animal populations. The animals shot provide meat, skin/fur to make items with, and helps out countless people by limiting traffic accidents by not having too many of the animals as well helping to preserve a farmers crops. If you are thinking of poachers then yes by all mean they are wrong as well.
The Soldier thing. Man, just be happy we have those guys as your little diatribe would have gotten you shot in a lesser country for dare saying something negative about your country. Our soldiers are not murdering psychopaths going on mass killing sprees to please their own insatiable appetites. They are men and women who have took it upon themselves to defend this country against those people who want to do us harm. Are some innocents killed? Yes. Is it sad? Absolutely. It is, however, not an intentional act (in the majority) and a lot of soldiers are never the same again after it happens. That is the definition of a mistake.
For you to compare either of these topics to Mike Vicks actions is an overreach and as ignorant an argument as I have heard on the subject. Lets break it down.
It was Vick’s culture. I still call bullshit. People who say it was not wrong in Vicks culture are spouting some nonsense. If in Vicks culture it was not wrong why would the participants take every precaution they could to hide it? Why wouldn’t someone try to make it a legal business? Why wouldn’t they advertise? Dog fighting was originally part of American culture yet somehow while the rest of our diverse cultures have grown out of it, Vicks southern roots still make it okay? Dog fighting has been officially illegal in all states since 1976. How long does it take for someone to adhere to the rules and laws of our land? The culture defense is now null and void.
What about reasonings behind it? A chief reason is for financial gain. Vick had just signed one of the richest contracts in the history of the NFL. Was the 10 to 20 grand he made off of a round of fights finally letting him feed and support his family? I thought the 112 million he was going to make as a NFL QB could do that. No this is not a justifiable reason either. So what does that leave us with?
Vick promoted, funded, and watched illegal dog fights because it was entertaining to him. That’s it. That is the only reason out there. He got his jolly’s off watching animals slaughter each other. That, my friends, is a piece of shit human being no matter how else you try to explain it. To even contemplate trying to compare him to the other two subjects you broached is just a… I can’t even find the right words for that kind of stupidity.
Anyway I apologize that this has nothing to do with the original intent of this fan post but this kid pissed me off.
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 24, 2010 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Dog fighting was originally part of American culture
It still is a part of the American culture. And it’s not just the “Vick’s” of the world that are doing it. Gog fighting was outlawed YEARS ago long before Vick took up the SPORT. Yes SPORT, like cock fighting and bull fighting. He learned from someone who learned from someone else. As for advertising, do drug dealers advertise (well outside of drug companies) ? NO. Trust me when I tell you Mike Vick was small potatoes when it comes to interstate dog fighting rings. There are people who have thousands of dogs. Multiple handlers who go ALL OVER THE WORLD to engage in the SPORT.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
by eaglelover1 on Sep 24, 2010 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions
do drug dealers advertise (well outside of drug companies) ? NO.
correct. And why is that? Because they know what they are doing is illegal, hence wrong. My point was that people ,lots of people, tried to give Vick a pass by claiming that to him running the dog fighting operation wasn’t wronjg because that’s just how it was done where he grew up. I was showing how he and every other person who runs such an operation know damn well that it is indeed wrong. Your last point is no doubt true, and I think every one of them should be put away, but the issue here was people who try and give Vick an excuse like he didn’t know any better. He did and his decision to participate was not a mistake but a blatantly degenerate and sick act.
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 24, 2010 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions
hunting is a means of population control...hmm
So Brett Farve is controlling the population of deer where he lives? So if we’re not hunting we’re not doing our civic duty? No doubt that hunting entails all of what you said but I doubt most hunters think about controlling deer populations. Besides that, nobody is saying what Vick was right and legal. I think people hate Vick because of the people who root for him. It’s sad people can’t get over Vick’s transgressions but I guess people love carrying hate with them for some reason.
Atlanta will win a championship....someday
Your right, most hunters want the meat. Most hunters spend countless hours waiting for a deer so they can shoot it, eat it, and use whatever else it has to offer. The fact that it is an effective means of population control and state funding (which is why they have limits on how many you can shoot, they require you to pay for the license, etc.) is just a good added bonus. It is still in no way even remotely similiar to the torture and killing of 80 plus dogs for pure entertainment value. People who fault me for not getting “over Vicks transgressions” are just as abusrd to me as I am to them. Everybody says Vick deserves a second chance. here’s a question. All those dogs that lost and were electrocuted, drowned and hung for performing poorly where is their second chance? When do they get a chance to be a loved pet? When do they get an opportunity to be fed, watered, and cared for just because their owners want them for compainionship? They don’t. So why does the orchestrater of their meaningless deaths get a chance to resume a profitable career as a sports star? When he performs poorly can we torture and kill him? Why not?
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 24, 2010 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Do you feel that way about the players who killed human beings?
Just wondering cause if not then your view point is ridiculously retarded. Not trying to be mean or anything just saying thats a very unforgiving system you got going on there.
UDDDDAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!
Η κόλαση δεν έχει μυστικά
E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!!!!!!
"fuk u i hate peas"- CNCITINFO (Random BGN troll)
I damn sure do feel that way. Stallworth should still be in jail in my opinion. Carruth should of got the chair. Leonard Little, prison. Whenever you take a life due to recklessness or malicious intent I call that throw away the key time. If you take a life while defending your property, life, or the life of another that is called justifiable. Now do I think Vick should be in jail forever because of his crime? No. I do believe that his sentence should have been longer and I think that his NFL playing days should have been over. He had his great opporuntity and chose to throw it away on idiocracy. Finished in my book. I make excpetions for noone because I might like them more then the next person. Favorite Eagle player of all time is Brian Dawkins. If Brian Dawkins drank himself stupid tomorrow, got in his car and then drove into any random person and killed them, I’d want 20 years for him at a minimum. My views may not be popular or pleasant but they are consistent for all.
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 24, 2010 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Thats all I wanted to know
My biggest beef is the people mad just because it is dogs. Ya know?
UDDDDAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!
Η κόλαση δεν έχει μυστικά
E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!!!!!!
"fuk u i hate peas"- CNCITINFO (Random BGN troll)
People are mad because it is barbarism.
Not because it is dogs. Carruth should have been fucking electrocuted.
"Up yours, asshole!"--EvilBanner to effeminate yachtsman Boston Jeff Lurie
torture and killing of 80 plus dogs for pure entertainment value.
There was no torture and killing for entertainment the fight was for entertainment the KILLING was to end the dogs suffereing. It’s the same with Horse racing, Cockfighting, Rodeos. If the animal is hurt beyond help or it’s injuries prevent a quality life you put it to sleep. Don’t read and listent to what the media and PETA says they are drumming up empathy not reporting the truth.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
so why so many different forms of “ending the dogs suffering”? Hanging, drowning, electrocution. Not one form of euthanization that is considered humane. Also his actions led directly to the dogs suffering. See what I am saying, why are you giving this guy any sort of out at all? He fucking helped run a organization that profited off the entertainment value of dogs fighting to the death. That is the most simple thing to understand and if it doesn’t anger you then you are a soulless, less then human scumbag as well.
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 25, 2010 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions
if it doesn’t anger you then you are a soulless, less then human scumbag as well.
Well I guess in YOUR world where YOUR moral code and YOUR ideals and mores matter I am a " soulless, less then human scumbag". It does not anger me as I know what is done with loser dogs and maimed animals in this culture.
However, in my world you are a whinny ass, bitch ass, over the internet judger of all men, who probably still lives in his mother’s basement. You, of the bleeding hearts for dogs has probably walked over homeless men asking for food as you threw away the half eaten reamins of a triple whopper. Yet you see nothing wrong with that.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
by eaglelover1 on Sep 25, 2010 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions
1) I got my own room in my parents house, so there.
2) I am one of the few that does help the homeless with money, food or anything else I can donate including time so fuck you very much.
I may be judging you and maybe it is not right but it is my right and I still consider you a piece of shit. Downgrade my morals all you want, but I know I am a better person then you so thats good enough.
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 26, 2010 9:29 PM EDT up reply actions
You are dead on.
Vick is a piece of shit human being.
"Up yours, asshole!"--EvilBanner to effeminate yachtsman Boston Jeff Lurie
How long does it take for someone to adhere to the rules and laws of our land?
No one adheres to every law of this land. Do you speed? Ride in a car without a seatbelt? If you have children have you ever spanked them? These are laws of this land that you have broken.
Remember people, Your bible states.." NO SIN IS GREATER THAN ANOTHER".
" The culture defense is now null and void"
How is a person’s culture null and void? Is it because of another man’s morality? Yes i think that is it. Even though a majority of the people of this country could care less about dog fighting. These are the ideals of those elected into congress not the beliefs of the entire population.
" He got his jolly’s off watching animals slaughter each other."
Your football fan… I bet you like boxing as well… What about MMA, UFC, Wrestling? Ohhh I know the participants WILLING do this for financial gain… Ever see a pack of dogs in the street? Guess what happens if they all run across the same peice of meat? Yeah that’s right. Do you know that dog fighting in China is a nationl sport? And if dogfighting is wrong why is cockfighting not? Know what happens to a rooster that loses a fight and the owner is upset? Yep, TORTURED AND KILLED. What about those poor horses that never win a race ever seen what happens to them? Did you know horse breeder kill more horses than they train to compete? Didn’t know that did you?
Morality Morality, Morality. It differs from man to man subject to subject.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
Is cockfighting wrong? hell yeah, hence why it is also illegal in this country.
How is a person’s culture null and void?
Did you read a damn thing before that line? I am saying that defense for Mike Vick is null and void because it is not a valid defense.
Really boxing, football, MMA, wrestling? You compare these things to dog fighting? Lets put this out there. Those are choices by the participants not 2 animals locked in a cage forced to fight each other. That very well may top the dumb shit the other guy said.
Ever see a pack of dogs in the street? Guess what happens if they all run across the same peice of meat? Yeah that’s right.
Once again, this is a retarded statement. You are trying to compare natural survival instincts to orchestrated fights.
Do you know that dog fighting in China is a nationl sport?
Good for fucking China. They also limit the number of children you can have and perform live birth abortions if the family has a second kid. This isn’t fucking China, this is America and here dog fighting is illegal.
Horses being put down are put down with a chemical compound that causes instant death. They are not hung, drown or electrocuted. They are not pit to a death match beforehand.
Morality Morality, Morality. It differs from man to man subject to subject.
Anybody whose morals don’t find the act of putting 2 dogs in a fight to the death unmoral, is not a man at all but a spineless coward who isn’t fit to breathe the oxygen this world produces. Fuck that man right in his pussified eyeball.
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 25, 2010 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions
"They also limit the number of children you can have"
It becasue of over population dumbass. I swear YOU PEOPLE are so fucking smart it almost makes you dumb. You see a dog as your equal and not as an animal. But you see a MAN that is different from you as an animal.
Fuck it. Let me say this the way it is. White people have problems. It is white people that have problems with dog fighting. The rest of the population of this country don’t. Yet, only the white man can PROFIT OFF OF PAIN. War, Drugs, Guns, Alcohol, Cigarettes, and anything else that kills a WHITEMAN is making money off of it. The minute a non-white makes starts to make money from it uhhhh that’s illegal.
Stop judging people while you sit on your righteous ass throne. I am willing to bet you smoke weed, ILLEGAL. Drank underage ILLEGAL. Had sex unwed MORALLY ILLEGAL. Man I wish you and I were face to face with this arguement I would have knocked your dumbass out! Go cry for a river for those dogs while you send your girlfriend to get a 3rd abortion. Don’t cry here this is a SPORTS BLOG not a damned church where you are the pastor using your own morality as a means to say what people should and shouldn’t do.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
by eaglelover1 on Sep 25, 2010 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Dude I disagree with Talon but way to be a fucking douche
UDDDDAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!
Η κόλαση δεν έχει μυστικά
E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!!!!!!
"fuk u i hate peas"- CNCITINFO (Random BGN troll)
Dude I disagree with Talon but way to be a fucking douche
am I a douche for telling the truth or because I am telling the truth?
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
This is the douche paragraph all of which is something you are assuming
Stop judging people while you sit on your righteous ass throne. I am willing to bet you smoke weed, ILLEGAL. Drank underage ILLEGAL. Had sex unwed MORALLY ILLEGAL. Man I wish you and I were face to face with this arguement I would have knocked your dumbass out! Go cry for a river for those dogs while you send your girlfriend to get a 3rd abortion. Don’t cry here this is a SPORTS BLOG not a damned church where you are the pastor using your own morality as a means to say what people should and shouldn’t do.
Also please learn to block quote
UDDDDAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!
Η κόλαση δεν έχει μυστικά
E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!!!!!!
"fuk u i hate peas"- CNCITINFO (Random BGN troll)
"Also please learn to block quote",
i like the way I do it
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
also
Do you know this guy personally? If not why are you defending another man and ASSuming that I am wrong about him.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
No I dont know him personally but that isnt grounds to
Bash him and “ASSuming”? yea ok you are very mature arent you
Are you reallly going to get mad that I assume you are wrong but you are still going to continue to assume you are right shut the hell up
UDDDDAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!
Η κόλαση δεν έχει μυστικά
E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!!!!!!
"fuk u i hate peas"- CNCITINFO (Random BGN troll)
Fuck it. Let me say this the way it is. White people have problems. It is white people that have problems with dog fighting. The rest of the population of this country don’t. Yet, only the white man can PROFIT OFF OF PAIN. War, Drugs, Guns, Alcohol, Cigarettes, and anything else that kills a WHITEMAN is making money off of it. The minute a non-white makes starts to make money from it uhhhh that’s illegal.
If I say that about black people, I’d get called racist. That’s why you’re a douche. And no, it is not the truth. It is unjustified stereotyping at best.
And it is highly ironic you went on a rant about that but then said “don’t cry here this is a SPORT blog…”
RIP Jim Johnson, best ever.
If I say that about black people
yuo can’t say that about black people cause black people don’t profit off of pain man
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
by eaglelover1 on Sep 29, 2010 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions
ummm. Ever hear of the crack epidemic in the 80’s? White people weren’t going into Watts, or Staten Island or wherever and slanging crack. Every race profits off of pain somehow.
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 29, 2010 6:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Right. All the black drug dealers that are selling meth, crack, cocaine, and all sort of other shit aren’t profiting off of pain.
RIP Jim Johnson, best ever.
All the black drug dealers that are selling meth
Where are the drugs comming from? Where does the Black STREET LEVEL dealer get hs drugs? All Drug dealers aren’t arrested some are presidential friends. Some are even presidents of other countries that are allowed to import these drugs into our country.
To Talon Talent They weren’t slanging the drugs but they were comming down BUYING the drugs and then selling them to their friends.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
Where are the drugs comming from? Where does the Black STREET LEVEL dealer get hs drugs? All Drug dealers aren’t arrested some are presidential friends. Some are even presidents of other countries that are allowed to import these drugs into our country.
Great job avoiding the statement. Regardless of where they get it from, black drug dealers are still “profiting off of pain”, like you accuse every white guy doing.
RIP Jim Johnson, best ever.
by Imp on Oct 1, 2010 7:36 PM EDT up reply actions
I may be judging morals but you are here guessing facts that are not true.
1) I don’t smoke weed so yeah thanks for that.
2) I did drink underage, you know before I had a real understanding of right and wrong. Since I am no longer underage this is a moot point.
3) Show me where unwed sex is illegal? Sex is purely pleasure and people who elevate it to this all glorious level are a big problem with this world.
4) Really you turned this into a white/black thing? Interesting twist I must say. I have stated several times I don’t give a fuck what your race is. if Peyton manning ran an illegal dog fighting ring, same fucking response. If Tony Gonzalez ran it, same damn thing. If fucking Marvin Martian came down and ran that shit I’d want his ass locked up. Get out of here with trying to turn this shit into a race thing. That’s you copping out because you have no more valid points to make.
5) Highly against abortion but that is not a discussion relevant to this conversation so next.
6) Did you just say you’d kick my ass if we were face to face? Interesting approach. I love internet fights. Try not to hurt your fist while punching your monitor.
Anyway, you suck and thats my final moral decision. peace whore.
(to everybody else I know the last response was childish but ehh fuck it, dude would whoop my ass if we were face to face so since he went 1996 on me i figured i could too.)
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 26, 2010 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Show me where unwed sex is illegal
I said MORALLY ILLEGAL. You know in your BIBLE that book that says let he who is without sin cast the first stone.
“Really you turned this into a white/black thing”
No this whole episode has been a white black as whites have been quick to condemn the man even though he has PAID HIS DUES to society. Your whole arguement has been about the legal status of dog fighting but, if it was legal would you then forget YOUR morals?
" Did you just say you’d kick my ass if we were face to face?"
i sure did and I still would. Name calling and questioning another man’s morals based on your own have started greater wars than the battle we are having now. And these are your words prior to me PROMISING to WHOOP YOUR ASS if we were face to face…….
“Anybody whose morals don’t find the act of putting 2 dogs in a fight to the death unmoral, is not a man at all but a spineless coward who isn’t fit to breathe the oxygen this world produces”
" if it doesn’t anger you then you are a soulless, less then human scumbag as well."
See, ass you do not know me if we were face to face and you uttered those words AN ASS WHOOPING would have promptly started and not stopped until the police arrived to taser me as would have been their desired non lethal way of ending your torture.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
by eaglelover1 on Sep 29, 2010 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions
if it was legal would you then forget YOUR morals?
Probably not. But it would be something that I don’t have a valid argument against. I could still plead my case but if the law of the land deemed it as acceptable it would just be a fruitless endeavor. Since it is not legal, my argument against it holds even more weight.
whites have been quick to condemn the man even though he has PAID HIS DUES to society
Really? Not one black man in all of America considers his sentence light or still considers him a piece of shit? I didn’t know that poll was taken. I’d love to see it. I am willing to bet there is a member of every race that feels the way I do about him and though he has “paid his dues to society” according to the legal system he still has a lot to do assuage the general public.
As far as your empty threat on whooping my ass. 1) it’s a very childish approach. “Oh I was called a name now I want to fight.” 2) since we will most likely never meet its an easy enough threat to make 3) you don’t know me, for all you know I could be the next Bruce Lee or some shit. I am not but that is besides the point. calling out people on the computer in this day and age is a risky propostion for anybody. Now I could issue a return threat here but since I am no longer 14 years old I’ll just smile to myself and remember when I was dumb and young.
Anyway, the whole point here is that while my morals may not be in line with yours I believe they would more likely resemble the majority of people in America (perhaps more rigid and less forgiven) but I feel pretty secure with them. If you want to be the “rebel” and take the low road, then by all means do, but don’t get all pissy when someone considers you a piece of garbage because it. if you were secure in your decisions, you’d just laugh it off and keep on truckin.
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 29, 2010 6:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Dude just because we are willing to forgive Vick doesnt mean we are taking any low road
I agree that this kid is a douche but dont lump the rest of us in with him
UDDDDAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!
Η κόλαση δεν έχει μυστικά
E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!!!!!!
"fuk u i hate peas"- CNCITINFO (Random BGN troll)
Uda I ain’t lumping you man. I guess this convo turned into a more me vs him dialog/attack. Besides I consider him taking the low road because as he stated above “he doesn’t see anything wrong with a little dog fighting”. He is obviously a racist (hence the white man causes all problems, feeds off pain, etc.) . Although I don’t want to forgive Vick I don’t hold ill will to those who do. I do however hold ill will to people who can’t see what he did was wrong and constantly give him an out by using some factless based excuse. Forgiveness is a key part to all of society and sometimes I wish I could be more forgiven, but when the punsihment wasn’t suitable by my tastes, it always makes it a lot harder to forgive.
"I will never have my best season," Brian Dawkins
"There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." Bruce Lee
"This fucking game is over!" Chuck Bednarik
"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson
by Talon Talent on Sep 30, 2010 9:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Aight
I mean I see things wrong with dogfighting but I dont think the excuses are entirley “factless” But hey thats a difference between me and you.
I think my punishment thing is a little extreme but at the same time forgiving.
You kill/rape/handicap someone for life you get either life in prison or someone takes you out back and kills ya.
Ill be little forgiving for the middle stuff.
What Vick did is in that weird gray area for me and Im willing to give him the benefit of the doubt cause he seems to have turned it around.
UDDDDAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!
Η κόλαση δεν έχει μυστικά
E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!!!!!!
"fuk u i hate peas"- CNCITINFO (Random BGN troll)
What Vick did is in that weird gray area for me
I agree with you. It is a bad thing but, the man has paid his due.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
He is obviously a racist
A black man cannot be a racist as black people have no ability to affect or change public opinion on anything. Racism is not just a belief but, a system of beliefs to put down other races due to stereotypes.
I could never be a racist but, I do see racism when it appears.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
ummmmmmm
A black man cannot be a racist as black people have no ability to affect or change public opinion on anything.
1. we have a black president soooo idk what you are thinking
2.and considering most black athletes are role models they change public opinions stopp being an ignorant asswipe
UDDDDAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!
Η κόλαση δεν έχει μυστικά
E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!!!!!!
"fuk u i hate peas"- CNCITINFO (Random BGN troll)
black athletes are role models they change public opinions
What public opinion did Jordan, Pippen, or Barkley change or affect? Carmelo, Lebron what…….
Kareem and Magic played in LA during a time that citizens in Central LA were being forced out of their homes and pushed up to Watts so that the City could by up that land. Detroit police were killing young black men by the dozens WRONGFULLY while Dumars, Thomas and Rodman played there yet they could do nothing to sway the perception that all blacks are criminals. Why is it that 95% of prisons are filled with a segment of the population that makes up less than 20 % of the US population? Are all blacks criminals?
I remember as a kid whenever a crime occured if the news didn’t show the perps face you knew he was a white person because black people are always gien the “perp walk”.
As for having a black president…..are you that naive son? Do you really believe that the president has any real power to change things? BLACK OR WHITE ? I am done with you. you obviously have white privilege syndrome nad nohing I type here you will understand. Nice talking to you.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
If you want to be the "rebel" and take the low road
Again you belittle someoe else’s choice to be different than YOU. Come on son, You choose to be unforgiving you have that right. But, you have no right to belittle others feelings.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
Oh god! I hope the army kills you.(jk)
Dude are you serious? It’s not the same. Not even close. Our Army “kills” people mostly insurgents but there is collateral damage for your freedom and our strength as a world power. The global power grab isn’t paddy cake boy-O.
Vick took animals and made them fight to the death. Do you know the history of this type of activity? It’s viewed as part of the immoral-ism that helped bring down the Roman Empire. Educate yourself so you don’t sound so f..ing stupid.
by Darth Banner on Sep 24, 2010 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions
He is very stupid.
And talking to him about the moral depravity that ate Rome from the inside out is likely a waste of your time.
"Up yours, asshole!"--EvilBanner to effeminate yachtsman Boston Jeff Lurie
It’s viewed as part of the immoral-ism that helped bring down the Roman Empire
IMMORAL-ISM????
Is it immoral to systematically kill and torture a RACE OF PEOPLE? If so then why did the US not FALL after it’s genocidal attacks on the Asain, African, and Indian populations? I am not saying that what Vick has done was legal( though I see no harm in a little dog fighting) but, you as a single man have no right to impose YOUR Morality on another man. That is called judgement and YOU have no right to JUDGE ANOTHER MAN’s actions based on your morality.
If you want to bring history into this Morality has caused more wars than any other single thing on this planet. Countless lives lost because one man’s MORALITY/RELIGION is different than another man’s.
I would love to blow up Texas Stadium... With team still in it
War is necessary
It has given you your freedom. You are comparing dog fighting to securing the freedom of your and every other democracy that our country and our soldiers have risked life and limb for.
Im agnostic and dislike organized religion. So I agree religion is used to control the masses. BUT that doesn’t mean morality isn’t real and real important to put things into perspective.
by Darth Banner on Sep 25, 2010 7:04 PM EDT up reply actions
BTW
I don’t care that Vick killed dogs. It kinda bothers me he gave girls herpes on purpose. But I didn’t know them. So ehh what-E. My qualm is with you disrespecting what many many young americans have died for, your freedom. I know are country lies to us and twists things. I also know they do what they need to to keep us in charge. AND that most liberals and americans would not allow them to be as brutal as they need to be, to give us the edge. I am more pro American than I am a humanitarian.
I don’t care if McNabb, Vick or Kolb or some pee wee kid plays QB for us. We are not close enough to winning a SB with this team. I feel that Vick will win us more games this year and put us further away from winning a SB. Andy, sean mcdermott need to be fired. Our defense and offense have too much talent to suck this bad.
by Darth Banner on Sep 25, 2010 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions
well said philly is back
i would leave the war on terror and even racism out of it. let’s just focus on the animalism. pig and cow live in hell. dog and cat protected like almost human. pig and cows ARE LIVING IN HELL WITH NO HOPE. THEY ARE TORTURED SPECIES. now i eat my pig and cow like most americans but let’s not be hypocritical about the dog fighting and vick. how am i supposed to recognise a dog’s rights more than a pig or cows?
by andyfrombrooklyn on Sep 25, 2010 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
Not to anyone specific,
but it is not only wrong to compare what Vick did, to what soldiers have to do, but the arguement just does not make any valid point. A soldier’s goal is not necessarly to kill the enemy, but to put them in a position they are no longer combat effective, so we can complete our mission. If there is no opposition, great! If we can do it without killing someone, great! But if the enemy loses the fight, we do not drown, beat, electocute them because they lost the fight. The comparison is completely false, and I really hope that puts this part of the discussion to bed.
"If it bleeds, we can kill it" -Dutch
"Men are clinging to football on a level we aren't even aware of. For centuries, we ruled everything, and now, in the last ten minutes, there are all these incursions by women. It's our Alamo."
-Tony Kornheiser
Too Sane ...
[Note by JimmyK, 09/23/10 3:02 PM EDT ] – Here’s a guest post by BGN member D3Keith, which is too sane not to put on the front page…
I thought it was some condescending grandstanding on my part, lol
Also asking for recs is obnoxious.
But I’m glad I’m not the only one who felt it needed to be said.
Secretary of State for BGN aka "Most diplomatic man on this site," as appointed by Talon Talent
Still waiting for the Eagles to Bring It Home For Jerome
didnt gameplan for vick?
I’m sorry but I have no clue where some of u guys get your information. First off don’t u think it would be pretty damn stupid not to gameplan for vick at least just a little bit. I know kolb was the starter but Andy definitely talked about how vick would get more plays each game this year. Second, I heard on ESPN the packers said they did gameplan for him. He’s just that fast. I’m not gonna judge him off a game and half but from what I’ve seen so far wow
by flyeaglesfly10 on Sep 23, 2010 8:31 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Halle-bleepin’-lujah!!
>> In other words, I don’t hate any of these guys. I don’t think any of them suck. I’d much rather be choosing between Kolb and Vick and make the wrong choice, whatever that is, than make the right choice out of Trent Edwards and Ryan Fitzpatrick or Jason Campbell and Bruce Gradkowski. <<
Good post BUT for
Christs sake can they please trade one of these guys! I can’t tell you guys how excited I am to see them make the PO’s and lose just like last year. Yay!
We need more talent on defense OR we need a new D-Co. Hell I would love Cower to come in and change this team next year. Before I get the,“your an ungrateful fan with unreasonable expectations” shpeal. I treat myself the same. Doing well is expected and nothing to be excited about. Doing great and accomplishing my goal was the plan so smile raise my hand for 3o seconds and get back to fucking work. No one cares that you used to be good.
This makes sense
THE DEAL:
Talk about interesting developments! What a week. Full of emotions, questions, pride, doubts, anger, more questions. After an offseason of anticipation for the future of the franchise this change of events could ripple across the next few years. That is of course completely dependent on the off-record conversations that Kolb and Reid, and Vick and Reid have had throughout the process. By no means can Vick’s athletic abilities be questioned. But his resolve is definitely up on the table for review. He seems a changed man, but not making the top salary can humble a man. People don’t change. They only get better at understanding and projecting what people want to see.
No way am I saying Vick shouldn’t be the starter right now. What I mentioned above is on the minds of every prospective owner/coach in the league. A few well played quarters will not be sufficient proof that the Vick-risk is worth it. This goes the same for any talks for trading Kolb. A bad quarter while being cycled in and out of a game with another quarterback is not enough for any decision as to a player’s worth. Name any situation, where two quarterbacks have been cycled with any success? I can’t. Also, ask yourself about Vick’s performance while being cycled? Not so good either.
The season started out being about Vick. With Vick getting every forth snap of the first week’s game this was evident. Reid needs to, and I agree, showcase that Vick hasn’t lost the shine. This will define risk/cost if Vick were to be traded for draft-picks/players.
As for if the O-Line’s play contributed to this decision? It is the team-management’s responsibility to take everything into consideration when making a decision of this magnitude. The O-line is a young one, but they will learn and grow together because they are talented. Regardless, their job and performance will ultimately dictate the longevity of anyone under center, mobile or not.
What I am saying overall, is that bashing the organization, regardless of stance on the issue, is pointless. This is a business and it is their job to put us in the best position for the future (the future being tomorrow, the next day, and next year…). Remember, more money equals better players for the future, and Vick’s superstar equals seats today. But in any case this is Philly, a sports town if not thee sports town, and we fill those seats, win or not. So….
The point is that I don’t know. No one does, not even Reid. Kolb might know. He might work harder and focus more, or he might be a choke, no one knows. How this plays out? Up in the air!!!
How I would like this to go?
Play Vick for next few weeks, but cycle Kolb (see what if he really wants it and if he can focus under pressure). If Kolb looks good, keep showcasing Vick. Take Vick-trade this year for a 2nd and a 3rd if possible. If a trade happens, play Kolb to the end of the season and let him settle in as our starting QB. Use our picks to build a cycling O-line and take the division over.
If Vick doesn’t get traded or if Kolb doesn’t show any improvement in the system, keep playing Vick and keep an eye on his continued development as a passer (we need a passer). If Vick is the QB for Philly’s future, next year will be the only proof as to if his passionate return as a top-caliber was driven by pride or monetary responsibilities. In this situation keeping Kolb seems needed but not fiscally reasonable or responsible.
Look: We are Philly so playoffs are possible any year, it is just who we are. At the end of the day like Reid said, this is about Vick. Whether we like flashy-shiny things, or taking chances, it is foolish to assume any decision is the right one. We know Vick will always be amazing, if he has the equipment mentally to be a SB QB is unknown, but I wouldn’t doubt him if he were in that game. The question is what Kolb will do? Will he focus and shine? Or choke? If he gets traded and plays well we made a mistake, if he plays poorly we made a good move. If Vick gets traded and Kolb plays well we made a good move, if he plays poorly we made a mistake. Kolb’s move…. Go Green!!!
Interesting comment
As to a QB cycling that worked, Tony Eason and Steve Grogan on the Patriots.
Doug Williams and Mark Rypien on the Redskins.
Can’t think of others for now.
I think it could go like this:
Scenario 1: Vick keeps playing well. He gets extended. Kolb will get traded. The Eagles draft a QB with an eye on bringing him into the system in a couple of years (Kolb 2.0).
Scenario 2: Vick doesn’t play well. Kolb goes back in and finishes the season. He might do well enough to be thought of as the QB of the future, in which case Vick gets let go. If he doesn’t, Reid will make a judgment call as to which quarterback he keeps (probably Kolb due to contract) but also drafts a quarterback in round 1 or trades for one during the off-season.
Scenario 3: Vick plays well but gets hurt. Kolb goes back in. If he plays well, welcome to quarterback controversy. If he doesn’t, Vick gets extended and Kolb either becomes a backup or is traded.
Scenario 4: Vick has some good and some bad games, leaving opinions very divided on whether he should be extended or not. Kolb doesn’t play, or plays just a little in the tail end of a blowout, but not enough to tell if he’s really capable of playing well. Welcome to another QB controversy.
Or a gray area that incorporates bits of more than one scenario.
"Verde que te quiero verde..."
Το πράσινο είναι ζωή!
That's right, I bleed green multiculturally
"if you shut someone down with class, it's more effective" - Udalango
Very good points!
Thank you. Couldn’t remember the names or teams, but I knew that their were a few. I guess my scenarios were too wishful. I am an optomistic (spelling?) person and would like to see Kolb get at least a glimpse of a chance in a green jersey again. I just remember how good it felt seeing someone throw like he did in those games last year. He was dead accurate and had a presence about him that reminded me of some of the great pocket QB’s. Tough to say with so little to go by. Guess we’ll never know.
You could put a clown with a star behind center and I wouldn’t stop loving this team and supporting the team. Wonder how Weaver’s recovery is going. Think he got some good pain killers? Later
E-A-G-L-E-S
Kevin Kolb
For this to have been such a gut wrenching decision for Andy Reid, means to me, that Kolb must be destined for greatness ato some point because this seeed to be a no brainer to me. Football is too short a season to worry about feelings. Every Sunday is “win now or go home” practically!
Kolb is going to get killed if the offensive line does not shore up. Vick may get killed himself, but at least he has a chance to avoid the biggest direct hits from opposing defenses.
Did you see how that Green Bay linbacker closed out ground and smashed Kolb into the ground? How many of those hits before Vick was starting anyway? It was inevitable. If you’re an Eagles fan, pray for both QB’s because the offensive line has sprung a leak! Vick was sacked how many times last eweek? Vick, with 4.3 speed? Sacked that much? Imagine had that been Kolb!
www.spydersbasketball.com
Can I rec this one again?
Especially given the way the 3rd/4th quarter threads went.
Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and then beat you with experience.
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