Part 1 of a 1 part series (jk): Strengths and Weaknesses - the Philadelphia Eagles
by Chandus on Jun 20, 2009 1:58 AM EDT
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PrintI'm not trying to start anything up, I'm only elaborating on the kind of article Bye.Dawk wrote, he wrote pieces in his perspective on the strengths and weaknesses of the other teams in the BEast, I'll try, as a Cowboy fan, to write a piece on the Eagles and while trying to be objective (But no one is perfect, right Dawk?)
Strengths...
1) Brian Westbrook.
The guy is a pain in the @ss for opposing Defenses and a perennial top 5 RB in the past few years. Entering his 30s, has trouble staying healthy but finally his coach seemed to realize that giving him more than 350 touches per year would destroy him and soon. Last year's workload seems alright.
2) "Up the Middle" on defense - (the DT's and MLB).
It's though to run through the middle against Philly, while Mike Patterson and Broderick Bunkley as pass rushers leave a lot to be desired (for Eagle fans), it's extremely hard to move them. Stewart Bradley played really well behind them, making plays all over the field.
3) OLine.
The hyping machine is selling the storY of the best OLine in Football, but I don't think that they are going to be the best and I've my reasons:
1. Peters while great, hasn't been great in pass protection and run blocking in the same season, he's been hot in one and dead cold in the other.
2. Both Andrews brothers have health related questions to answer.
3. Jackson and Herremans have consistency problems.
4. Tra Thomas had a great year in 2008 and Jon Runyan was his solid, and nasty, self. They WILL be missed.
And 5. OLineman are creatures of habits, with Shawn Andrews missing so much of the previous season, we're talking about 3 players that need an awful lot of tme and work with the guys around them.
And still, OLine WILL be a strength for your team.
4) Playmakers on Defense.
Brian Dawkins will be missed, but still the Defense has a bunch of playmakers, from Asante Samuel to Trent Cole. I'll talk a little later about the Eagles pass rush and how they managed to get 48 sacks and the back 7 added 21 FFs, 14 Ints and a really high number of PDs. That's really good, they have a bunch of players that can make plays.
Weaknesses...
1) The pass rush.
I'm not talking about pass rush in general, I know that the team in the end finished with 48 sacks and ranked 3rd overall. I'm talking about 15 players with sacks, I'm talking about the sack leader being Howard (10) and how your team shouldn't depend on his health and consistency, I'm talking about Cole with 9 sacks and how the rest of the DLine starters managed only 7 sacks.
This is an area that might suffer from not having Jim Johnson anymore, 48 sacks and most of them come from players all over the field, I'll miss Johnson and I wish him good health, he knew how to use his guys.
2) TEs:
I kind of know what the NFC East LBs and Ss think of this TE lineup: Brent Celek, Matt Schobel and Cornelius Ingram... It isn't fear! Martellus Bennett, in his rookie year and with his 2 cent head, had a comparable year to that of Celek and bests most of the years in Schobel's career.
3) Safeties:
A long time ago, Roy "Thong" Williams used to be touted as a great Safety, the opinion started to receive some adversity when Darren Woodson (one of the best Safeties in our team history) went down. Williams was pressed to do too much and folded, in the end he couldn't even tackle well... What will happen with the Eagles after Dawkins? In the end we will know, but the truth is that a great Safety makes things easier for the guys around him.
4) Andy Reid.
Let's ask around the League to see what wins championships, let's ask the Steelers? Run, defense and win. Let's ask the pre-Moss Patriots? Run, defense and win. The 2006 Colts? Run, defense and win. The 2002 Buccaners? Run, defense and win. And the 2000 Ravens? Run, defense and win.
What's Reid modus operandi? Let's throw the ball between 60 and 80% of the time, not caring for having one of the best RBs in the League and one of the best DCs around.
And I'm not talking about a long list of known mistakes, like clock management and half time adjusments.
Two thumbs up to Reid, you guys would be a real pain in the @ss with just one Lombardi.
Other concerns (Neither strengths nor weaknesses)...
1) Sean McDermott.
I'll just make one question regarding him and, please, try to be objective with your answer: What would you think of the Steelers Defense if Dick LeBeau is forced to retire and a guy from his staff is pushed to take his place?
I would think that he has some huge shoes to fill.
2) Donovan McNabb.
If he's healthy and in his game, McNabb is a really productive QB and one of the best in the League. But last year he got benched for letting his game wander off and the most interesting thing is that he had one of his healthier years in his career... I'm expecting him to play and to do it well, as he has us used, but I wouldn't be surprized if he loses his focus or if he misses time due to injuries.
And that's it, I won't add a Poll, it serves no purpose, unless you want to add one about the names you would like to call me or something of the sort....
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Anybody who follows this site generally knows what the eagles strengths and weaknesses are. Although you pointed out a lot of things about the eagles, there are some flaws. Westbrook, although he is an amazing player and can not be matched, what about his injuries?Your weaknesses are not that solid either. The TE position has a huge upside potential, with Celeks performance in last years post season and Ingram showing a lot of promise. Although nobody can replace Brian Dawkins, we have acquired a fairly large group of decent-to-good safeties, and if one can not step up, another one will. And having Andy Reid under weaknesses is just despicable. You may not personally like him, but there is a reason that since he has become the Eagles head coach, we have won. During his tenure he has compiled the best win total (96), winning percentage (.608) and playoff victory total (10) in team history. I’m sorry that is not a weakness. Yes his strategy is different than other coaches, but it seems to work for the most part. I do not mean to point out every flaw, but this is an eagles website, you should expect people to know about their own team.
by worldphuckinchamps on Jun 20, 2009 2:19 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Pretty fair. Obviously the Eagles also have their share of question marks and concerns.
The health of Westbrook, McNabb, and the Andrews. No doubting that.
Peters, while extremely gifted, has to prove he can be a dominate pass blocker in general, especially against some very good in division competition.
The pass rush or lack of depth, I think is at most a ‘concern’ and not a weakness. We’re hoping Abiamiri can step up, along with maybe Smith. Also Clemons came on late season (had some healthy issues early) and should help take the pressure off Cole and an aging Howard.
You never know with the safety thing. I take solace in the fact I’ve heard several ‘experts’ claim Mikell was our best safety. I do think Dawkins was slowing down, and was often a hindrance in pass coverage. This is obviously a wait and see kind of thing, and deserves to be mentioned as a concern/weakness. Jones showed flashes of being a very good player in Cleveland and has a similar skill set to Dawkins.
Contrary to popular belief Reid does not pass the ball 90% of the time. I think a lot of us would like a little more running, and hopefully Weaver, Peters, and a healthy Shawn Andrews help us out when we decided to do. He does have his share of questionable clock management decisions, which I have no defense for. However although he hasn’t got a ring, Its kind of hard to question his overall game plan and strategy when he’s been able to get into and win in the playoffs consistently.
I’ll give you TE for sure. A big question mark for us. Celek preformed well late, but he can he build off of that success and can he block? We’ll see. Schobel has never been anything, and has very little support (if any) around here. Ingram is physical specimen and great pick where we got him, but I doubt he can step in a be a major factor in year one. I hope I’m wrong, but I’ll wait until I see results with him. I like the TE outlook for future, but its definitely a question mark.
I think McNabb will be fine (if healthy). He did have the terrible stretch that lead to his benching, so you never know, but he rebounded well, and figures to be back to ‘normal’
McDermott is definitely a concern. Obviously we want JJ in charge, and anyone else will probably take at least a slight turn for the worse. Hopefully he learned well and can get it done, like Spags did, but there’s knowing that for sure.
As for worldphuckingchamps, about fans knowing the strengths and weakness, I see this thread as a sounding board for other NFC east fans to fight back. On their threads you couldn’t really say ‘yeah well what about all the problems with your team’. It wasn’t relevant there, here it is.
Haha, it was only a matter of time...
Anyway, I’ll just focus on the 3 glaring mistakes…
The safeties…
Quintin Mikell – 2nd team NFL All-Pro.
Sean Jones – In the past 3 years, only 2 NFL safeties have more picks.
Quintin Demps – Nice, young, developing 2nd year player.
If you want to put them in the concern category because Demps is still somewhat unproven… fine. But they’re far from a weakness.
Andy Reid…
He inherited a bad team, and has put up the following records…
Regular Season record – 97-62-1
Playoff record – 10-7
Overall – 107-69-1
Also, gotta take issue with your reasoning why he’s a weakness… Because his teams are different than the Ravens, Steelers, and Bucs? That’s just dumb. What about the Patriots? The Rams earlier this decade? The Colts (which for some reason you erroneously grouped in with the Steelers, Ravens, and Bucs)? Those teams also passed a lot. And I’m not sure what is making you think the Eagles don’t play defense – just kind of scratching my head there.
Now, I’m not saying Reid is a strength. His time management is often terrible, he wastes challenges, and his situational playcalling can be incredibly frustrating (if you’re an Eagles fan). But your reasons for listing him as a weakness are complete nonsense, or a reach, or whatever you want to call it.
The pass rush…
You have absolutely no idea whatsoever what the Eagles D Line is all about. They rotate players in and out of the lineup the entire game to stay fresh throughout into the 4th quarter and late into the season. There’s ONE player on the D Line that will ever play more than 65% of the snaps – Trent Cole… That’s it. To say that “the other 3 starters only had 7 sacks” is absolutely retarded. Who really cares if a bunch of guys are contributing anyway? Isn’t that a good thing? Here are the Eagles sack totals from 2008…
Howard – 10
Cole – 9
Parker – 5
Clemons – 4
Dawkins – 3
Gaither – 2.5
Mikell – 2
Gocong – 2
Abiamiri – 2
Bunkley – 2
Klecko – 2 (Yup, even our fullback got in on the action)
Demps – 1
Hanson – 1
Brown – 1
Bradley – 1
Patterson – .5
16 players got to the QB last year. How is that a weakness?!?!? They’re deep, they’re young, and they’re talented. You got nothing here.
I think TEs are your only weakness but I think you have lots of unknowns.
The Oline is about cohesiveness. You got some big talented guys but some are coming off of iffy seasons. New teams and new positions. With the 3 Ds your guys are facing with their/our schemes and talent if you dont have it together it could get ugly fast.
Brian Westbrooks health.
JJs replacement. I keep reading over and over how JJ trained this guy and with the same players and scheme their shouldnt be a let up. Are yall convincing us or are you trying to convince yourselves. Your D should be top 10 because of the things you pointed out but will he call the right D at a crucial point in the game. Does he know when and where to blitz. Does he know how to set up an OC for a big play late in the game. Can he get it done with the game on the line. Jason Garrett is a guy who has had a top offense 1 year and has a winning record against Spags and a split with JJ. Problem is he lost in the playoffs to the Giants and you guys at the end of the season when it counted the most. (Garrets a smart guy and should bounce back from a soph jinx) Im looking forward to how your new DC holds up late in the season and next year after everyone has a chance to get his tendencies. His real test doesnt come til Dec.
Chandus make a good point about your safeties. I need to be enlightened a little first. Was Dawkins the brain back there keeping guys in postions and knowing assignments. If he was, then your younger guys could miss him alot. With his knowledge he could turn loose Mickell if the right formation showed up and cover for him. Put him in the right place, give him presnap reads, and allow Mickell the ability not to have to think too much. Your a much better player when your not thinking and just reacting. Mickell might be a heady player and this is overblown but Dawkins wil be missed. It would have been better not to lose JJ and Dawkins in the same year.
Passing game. I have always felt that Mcnabb has made most of your WRs a little better than they really are. McNabbs ability to move around in the pocket has alway bought more time to get open. Throw in his threat to run 40 yards and he aids them even more. With his age and history of minor injuries and breakdowns do you really want to expose him to any extra hits. Do you really want him running around or would you rather he throw the ball away sooner. The ball needs to get out faster this year, if he gets hurt your done.
Desean, is he ready for more responsibility and alot more attention. Will he suffer from a sophmore jinx. I think he will have a good career overall but this year is going to be tougher. He has to better this year.
I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the goverment from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
There is a lot I could say about this post but most of you already said it.
The one thing i think you have way wrong though is McNabb as a concern. His injuries are a concern but every year he’s been healthy we’ve been to the playoffs. He’s only been injured 3 seasons and that was bad luck. Im sure you guys love tony homo over there in dallas but we easily have the best qb in the nfc east and one of the top 5 in the nfl. Didnt like your take on the O line either. You list them as a strenghth but everything you say about them makes them look flawed. The best O line in the NFC at least. There is not much at all you can say about that.
How can you have the best line when 2 guys are new and 1 is moving to a new positon. 2 struggled alot
last year. You have the makings of a great line but lines must play together as one. Maybe you should wait afew games before the anoiting oil is brought out. Giants line is the best. Their running game tells me they are.
I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the goverment from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
which 2 struggled last year?
I guess you could make an argument for the giants having one of the best O lines. The thing is though we all know the eagles are going to have a great O line. A lot of people are in denial because A) Your not a fan of the eagles and you want our line to fail miserably or B) You are an eagles fan and you just dont want to get ahead of yourself. Shawn andrews ia moving to tackle which is his natural position. So we have two multiple pro bowl lineman guarding the outside of the line. Then we have 3 very good lineman on the inside. Todd and Stacy are both great enough to play tackle but we already have 2 pro bowl tackles. Last think I wanted to point out is that all these players are in the prime of their careers. None over the age of 30. Ill let you have it if you want to call the giants the best O line. Theres no point in arguing about it because all i will hear is the “cohesiveness” of this line and how they havent played together yet. Im sure they’ll prove themselves and really dont even need me typing this. Also on a side note, we now have the best fullback in the nfc east who will help big time in the run and pass blocking game.
Shauwn Andrews was far from his best and Peters was a turnstile.
I expect them to bounce back but this is a new line and for Andrews a new position. They havent played together. Line communication is a must. They must work as a unit.
Andrews is a mauling beast when he is on. He shredded us 2 years ago. Reminded us a little of Larry Allen. Last year from what I read and based on his reduction in play he had personal issues or depression. Coming off that and moving to a new postion added to new people beside you. You might want the chicks to hatch before you count them.
When you have that and your going against the 4th best defense(redskins) last year, what should be an improved(already great)Dline for the Giants, and (I havent heard one peep out of you guys about this) our Defense, which happen to lead the league in sacks(59). Thats 6 games you better have your stuff together. 1 thing I can tell you about the Beast is any team can make you look worse than you are in a hurry. Dont come into a game without being ready or you’ll get your ass whooped.(us, game 17, last year)
I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the goverment from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
some truth there
we don’t know how it will work out…very true. however, andrews is moving to a position he played in college, and is reportedly excited for the move. Add in the new people beside him (his brother and college roommate), it’s likely that his personal issues will be alleviated. That’s just me speculating, but I think the new people and new position are something that will help him rather than hurt him.
1. You shouldn’t count your “eggs” before they hatch.
2. If you’re only concern for our Oline is the 6 games we play against the Beast, that gives our line 6 weeks to gel as a unit. That’s plenty of time. We’re either gonna be a solid team by week 7 or our weaknesses will be showing. Obviously i hope we’re healthy and gelling by week 7, that’s gonna be a very difficult 8 game stretch for the Eagles.
@wash, vs nyg, vs dal, @sd, @chi, vs wash, @atl, @nyg
"Eagles fans are a passionate group who love their team," said McNabb, "if not the actual players. It's not like winning a Super Bowl before the first month of the season is the hardest thing they've ever asked of me. That'd be all those times they asked me to go kill myself."
by greenbean#twoOH on Jun 21, 2009 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Damm that is a rough 8 week stretch. You will definitely know all you need to know after that string.
I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the goverment from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
Andy Reid is an odd one. He can be a total dumbass at times (ex: First Giants game; Giants been stopping the run all day, we were doing well at passing the ball. Final two plays, two runs. We lost.), while other times he’s very smart (ex: Second Giants game; first quarter was ending, we would have wind against us in the second. Andy call a timeout, kep wind to our backs. Akers kicked a field goal, 3-0).
He’s definitely not a perfect coach. I would be a lot less angry during Eagles games if he was. lol
Moo.
Hey Bye Dwk:(
Got a question for you…
As of right now in the entire NFL, which team(s) on paper look more primed for a great run than the Eagles? Which do you think will give us the most trouble?
Astra Inclinant, Non Necessitant
Nice, I like the requests. I think that the Pats (assuming Brady is OK) are easily the best team in the NFL. That offense is sickening… Brady, Moss, Welker, Ben Watson, Faulk, Morris, a solid O-Line… and then they go out and pick up Fred Taylor, Joey Galloway, Chris Baker, and the legendary Greg Lewis (kidding). Their defense has a few question marks (especially in the secondary), but I’m not sure how teams are going to outscore them. They lose their Hall of Fame QB for the season in the first quarter of Week 1, and still go out and win 11 games, then get much better in the offseason (the return of Brady aside).
Luckily, the only way we’d have to play them would be in the Super Bowl, and that would be fine with me.
The other team that I think is right there with us is the Giants. One of us is going to get screwed out of a first round bye and will have a first round playoff road game because we play in the same division.
But I think we can confidently argue that on paper (and paper means nothing of course – see the 2008 Cowboys), that we are a Top 3 NFL team.
By the way, speaking of Fred Taylor...
I would have loved to have seen the Eagles make a push for him. Anyone else out there agree that we’d be a lot better off with Westbrook/Taylor/McCoy than Westbrook/McCoy Booker?
Yup. I’ve always like the guy. He’s been passed over for the Pro Bowl more than almost anybody. 1 appearance all time, when he’s had 7 seasons over 1,000 yrds. He’s got a career y/a at around 4.6. Dude never fumbles either, 26 total in 11 years. IMO he’s grossly under rated as an offensive contributor.
Loooooook here brotha'.....who you jivein' with that Cosmic Debris!!!???
haha it would be too much effort to scroll up but im assuming u were talkin of bw
by AllPhillySport on Jun 23, 2009 12:46 AM EDT reply actions
next time
don’t be lazy, you missed the boat. The convo is about Fred Taylor and if the birds should have made a push to grab him before the Pats.
Never assume! havn’t you heard the old adage….ASS out of U and ME. i resisted to just post your out of your element donny, and opted to just fill you in.
"Eagles fans are a passionate group who love their team," said McNabb, "if not the actual players. It's not like winning a Super Bowl before the first month of the season is the hardest thing they've ever asked of me. That'd be all those times they asked me to go kill myself."
by greenbean#twoOH on Jun 23, 2009 1:19 AM EDT up reply actions
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