Not another "fair weather" post
by jalarsen1 on Oct 26, 2009 2:54 PM EDT
Email
Print
To Clarify from Northern Eagles post. McNabb critics were being called 'fair weather' and that deserves a consideration:
A fair weather fan is one who bails when the going gets tough. These are the people that give up on their team when they are losing. Most fair weather fans are casual fans. They know the all-star names on the team, and watch the game socially if they’re around friends.
The fact that any of us are even on here midweek talking Eagles is proof enough that we are, by and large, not casual fans. This fact alone says two things:
1. We are not fair weather. None of us are jumping ship and rooting for other teams. The Eagles are our team, even if they were to suck.
2. Our passion gives us the right to critique the team, and this has a further implication. It means we are all essentially ‘fair weather’ fans of particular players. We want what’s best for the team, regardless of what that means. If it means cutting Trotter, we do it. If it means signing him back, we do it. If it means benching McNabb half way through a game to light a fire under his ass, we do it. When Andy flip-flopped between Jordan and Gaither at Will last year, was he being “fair weather”? No. He was forming his opinion of what personnel package is best for the team.
I flip flop on McNabb, and I've been called out for it; but let's not pretend that consistency of opinion is a virtue in itself.
55 comments
|
7 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
i agree i don't think anyone on here is a "fair weather" eagles fan
and i think criticism of a qb is inevitable anymore. there’s a lot put on his shoulders and they get the glory for the wins so, for the most part, they get the criticism for the losses.
now, don’t get me wrong, i’ve defended mcnabb all week and pretty much his entire career. But, i’m not gonna call someone a fair weather mcnabb fan if they criticize him. for example: if trotter has a big game next week i’m gonna be wearing my old trotter jersey. but as of right now, i don’t want him on the field.
bottom line: when you love a team, you want them to do well. you criticize some players when they show questionable abilities in some areas. we all do. just because its mcnabb doesnt mean he’s excused. BUT, you also want the best player on the field and anyone who doesn’t think that’s mcnabb is just thickheaded.
We all are Fans of the Birds...
I hate when ppl give their opinion on a certain topic, then get called “Not a real fan” or as u said “Fair Weather Fan”! We’re here for Eagles talk (mainly). And almost EVERYTHING we write or say is mostly OPINION based! No one is exactly right or wrong, cause we can not see the future. We and try and predict the outcome, but that’s it. We all have a common goal. And that’s to see the Eagles move forward, succeed and bring home that Superbowl trophy. Is it a rule that we have to like and agree with EVERYTHING the FO/Reid and the Birds do. Course not! I’ve said b4 that their are THREE styles of fans..1) Fans who agree with everything the team does throughout the team and Organization and don’t question them. 2) Fans that do the opposite. They question the Team (Coach, Players, Organization) when things need improvement or need to be changed. They won’t settle for just getting by. 3) Fans who just want to win and don’t care bout anything else.
But we all Love the Birds and want them to succeed! We all have passion for the Birds cuz we care for our team. That’s why we’re here on this site and other Eagles sites. Cuz we support out TEAM as a whole!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Amen
I completely agree. I know I’m biased towards defending people who criticize certain players, because I am critical sometimes. However, I honestly want what’s best for the team and to win a Super Bowl.
Many of our player based arguments stem from our personal perspectives’ on life, e.g. a young person posting might want to give young, unproven talent a chance after watching “proven veterans” not get the job done. I realize that this example doesn’t characterize all of the posters, but I believe that these different views and ways of looking at things allow us to make better judgments and assessments of the team regardless of where our initial opinions came from.
Please don’t insult other posts unless they are so ignorant they make you nauseous (normally from people who post in all CAPS).
Now for an actual Eagles point: McNabb has played very poorly over long stretches the last couple of years (since 2005). I know we all wish that he can pull out some of the magic he had earlier in his career, but I don’t think it’s going to happen. I hate limbo years more than anything. The 2007 8-8 season was as much of a failure as 2005 to me. Last year was a Raiders win away from being just as bad. I don’t know what the ceiling on Kolb is, but after 11 years I think we have seen McNabb’s. I don’t think we should wait until we are mathematically eliminated from the playoffs to see what we have in Kolb. My leash is 4-4. If we lose the next two, time for a change. Good luck to the Birds tonight, but if they don’t put on a good showing please do not tell me that we can’t make changes because "it’s our best shot at winning." That’s like passing 50 times when your quarterback is struggling, just because it seems like it should work doesn’t mean it will.
"Seriously… F off." JasonB to a Denver fan after Dawk left.
by DownHillBradley on Oct 26, 2009 3:43 PM EDT reply actions
I would not call it fairweather...
but calling a player elite one week and bailing on him after that player has a poor game is just as bad.
Andy Reid has to live with Sunday's reality: He was out coached by Tom Cable. (John Clayton)
Since 2005: Andy Reid 36-32-1; 7-25-1 when tied or losing at halftime.
by Route36 on Oct 26, 2009 3:46 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
I've been calling McNabb elite for years
Zorknemesis pulled out my quote where I questioned whether we would win more games with Kolb…
Not that I thought Kolb was better, but I do think the game planning with Kolb under center is better because it’s more balanced
I’ve never said McNabb wasn’t elite, but I am starting to wonder if we’ve seen his ceiling.
"What did it feel like? That collision, I didn't feel nothing, because he was pretty much defenseless. It was like running through a cardboard box. Seriously. Cardboard box."- Sheldon Brown on his pounding of Reggie Bush in the '06 Playoffs
“Sure he’s elite, BUT..” But nothing. He’s elite. So you ride him. If the Eagles aren’t successful, you do everything you can to help the great players out. If the gameplan is causing the team to struggle, the problem is with the gameplan and not with the talent executing it. Look at the Redskins. They were once an incredibly dynamic offensive team, with Clinton Portis, Chris Cooley, and Santana Moss. Then the following things happened: they changed offensive coordinators twice, and installed a WCO system with players who were not drafted to play in a WCO. Jason Campbell is not a WCO QB, and Santana Moss is not a WCO WR. Now they’re scoring single digits every week, and in complete disarray.
Most of the responsibility for the Eagles’ offense falls on Marty Mornenweig, who has been regressing and reverting every 3 weeks since he first came here. You may recall the first couple of games and how ESPN condescendingly shouted “HEY LOOK, THEY’RE RUNNING THE BALL!” And then, as if a jinx had been sparked, the team quickly regressed to throwing and throwing and throwing. Then Marty remembered they had a running game, and they started doing it again. Then he forgot. Then Jeff Garcia took over, at the same time as Marty reverting back to running. That pattern has continued over and over to this day.
What happened on Sunday? The Eagles had backups at LT and LG, and the pocket could not hold up at all. People have talked about how McNabb missed on plays when he did have protection, but don’t understand that it is impossible to make good plays when you are shell shocked, which happens to ALL QUARTERBACKS, including the elite. Think about Peyton Manning against the Patriots all those years, being unable to thwart their defense. The struggles he’s had against the Chargers in his career.
Once a game starts going downhill, QBs don’t just magically recover. It certainly doesn’t help when receivers drop easy passes and make things even more difficult. Some people might point to Brees against the Dolphins on Sunday, but I could just as easily point to the Eagles-Chiefs 05 meeting, in which the team came back from an identical deficit to win. And as much as it will pain fans, the Giants comeback against the Eagles in 06. Those are extraordinary collapses. They happen once or twice a year in the entire NFL.
The Bears and Bengals who played on Sunday are probably the best example of how games are won at the trenches. The Bears have only won games this year when the offensive line has been able to protect Cutler and open lanes for Forte (perhaps replacing Ryan Grant as most overrated ‘rising star’ RB). The Bengals were a horrific team last year, and suddenly, with the offensive line actually blocking, they look like the 11-5 team that were a QB injury away from competing for the Super Bowl. Cedric Benson actually looks like a #1 pick.
This was the reason that the Eagles went out and got Jason Peters in the first place. They knew that without a capable LT, their offense would not work. Was that why Marty called so many passing plays against the Raiders? I don’t think that excuses him, since none of them were bootlegs or rollouts which would have made life a little easier. All I know is that King Dunlap cannot, cannot, cannot see another down on the field.
I agree that the O Line and game planning were the issues
I also agree that Dunlap was terrible. Although I was really down on Justice after his Giants debacle last year, and I’ve been impressed with him so far this year. Maybe Dunlap can turn this around.
"What did it feel like? That collision, I didn't feel nothing, because he was pretty much defenseless. It was like running through a cardboard box. Seriously. Cardboard box."- Sheldon Brown on his pounding of Reggie Bush in the '06 Playoffs
You're Right! They aren't Fairweather Fans. Cant be since they arent "fair" at all!
Besides the obvious (win a superbowl) what ELSE does Dmac have to do to get the same loyalty from philly and its fans that he’s given them over the course of his whole career. Seriously, I am so sick of hearing so much griping about mcnabb this and mcnabb that, what i dont EVER hear is THANKS Dmac, thanks for all your rushing yards, and TD’s, and lack of INTs, THANKS DMAC for taking us to win after win after win and playoff after playoff and NFC championship game after NFC championship and oh thanks for taking us to to that superbowl because it’s been a while since we got there before you arrived. Sheesh! it kills me that this guy’s done nothing but perform at a high level year in and year out and ALL philly fans give in return is howls for his JOB year in and year out. Seriously, Our (eagles fans) reputation around the league is well deserved, we booed him when we drafted him, booed him during his prolific career AND know that we’ll figure out a way to boo him when he goes into the hall.
Agree wholeheartedly
They want to put Kolb (who has the arm strength of a rapid onset ALS patient) out there and see what he can do. You want to talk about seeing ceilings? You’ve seen Kolb’s goddamn ceiling. He can’t beat the Saints and he can beat the Chiefs.
"Right now Winston Justice is the guy...until that person gets back out there"
I have cheered mcnabb his entire career
but why can’t I say he’s sucked this year so far, when half the games he has played in he’s looked bad. That’s not being hard on him…it’s being honest. It’s being fair. The majority of Kolb bashers claim go around harping on how he had 3 ints against NO, knowing full well that 2 of them came in the last two minutes in desperation. That’s unfair. I can say when Kolb sucked. I can say when McNabb sucked. I can say when Reid sucked. that doesn’t mean I don’t respect what they’ve done. It means, more than likely, that they sucked.
+1
That’s why I posted what I did about ‘fairweather’. This idea that we can’t criticize poor play is ridiculous. McNabb hasn’t played well. Why do people assume that I’m unappreciative of his AWESOME career by saying he isn’t playing well now?
"What did it feel like? That collision, I didn't feel nothing, because he was pretty much defenseless. It was like running through a cardboard box. Seriously. Cardboard box."- Sheldon Brown on his pounding of Reggie Bush in the '06 Playoffs
we can all agree he hasn’t played well. Its the people that scream for Kolb after one bad game that bothers me. My thing is… give him a chance to get back on his feet… if he has opportunities and continues to miss them – then its time to find a temporary replacement. Theres nothing wrong with having competitiveness on our team in the QB department, as we saw after the Bmore game last year. I just hope he gets his shit together. He’s still my QB. So I’m with you on that one.
In life, as in a football game, the principle to follow is: Hit the line hard.
-Theodore Roosevelt
How about “John Kerry fan” or “That was very wafflish of you”
"Seriously… F off." JasonB to a Denver fan after Dawk left.
by DownHillBradley on Oct 26, 2009 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions
or very “Brett-like”
"Seriously… F off." JasonB to a Denver fan after Dawk left.
by DownHillBradley on Oct 26, 2009 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Ive been back and forth on mcnabb as of the past 2 years I haven't considered him elite
E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!
Speakin of being a Fan of the Eagles.........
Did anyone else watch OTL today !!!
I know the media is full of you know what especially ESPN and Sal Pal. But the opening piece on Vick and the Eagles was crap. More importantly, it was BS !!!!!
I didn't see it
but they’ll never get over Vick and the Eagles…they’re BEGGING for QB controversy just to write a story.
"What did it feel like? That collision, I didn't feel nothing, because he was pretty much defenseless. It was like running through a cardboard box. Seriously. Cardboard box."- Sheldon Brown on his pounding of Reggie Bush in the '06 Playoffs
I mean a pretty Smart cant, and not Naive..but
I just pissed me off cuz as usual They freakn had cuts from that Jags preseason game when Dmac gave the “supposed” “hang it up/ enough of Vick” hand signal, when in Reality that signal had nuttn to do with Vick at all! They had snip-its and sound bites, glued them together and tried to make it like Dmac hated Vick……
Im Overreacting I know! Cuz im just sick of this “Let’s turn Dmac and Vick against each other!” It aint gonna stop anytime soon. And as an Eagles fan, I don’t like when people look at our Team as something negative when that’s FAR from the truth. Our Organization I one of the most Successful community, stability and personality wise. That’s why Vick chose to come to the Birds. Cuz they’re are positive franchise. Don’t mind me, im just angry haha
Vick has yet to show
that he can even be remotely productive.
"What did it feel like? That collision, I didn't feel nothing, because he was pretty much defenseless. It was like running through a cardboard box. Seriously. Cardboard box."- Sheldon Brown on his pounding of Reggie Bush in the '06 Playoffs
Vick is nothing.
He does not exist.
"Right now Winston Justice is the guy...until that person gets back out there"
Bottom line: we would have won last week, McNabb's performance and all, if we just ran the damn ball
Every QB needs some kind of complementary running game to keep the defense honest.
That’s not his fault. Stop blaming him for the team not running the football. He was missing reads everywhere, correct. He probably would have made those throws if he wasn’t rattled from being beaten to piss in the pocket.
we run a WCO
which uses short passes/slants as running plays…he doesn’t really throw those balls very well. The play calling is still not right for his skill set (which is strange since he’s been the QB for 10 years) but people need to realize the lack of running is an aspect of the WCO.
Andy’s WCO is a tired style. In the beginning, it was awe-inspiring the damage we were doing to defenses. However, the predictability of the play calling is at a point where I can even call out what plays are about to be run. Opponents have caught up and I honestly feel you can game plan against the Eagles by using footage from a couple years ago.
Totally agree with the WCO not fitting his style. He is a really good play-action QB. Unfortunately, there is no running game to really work the play action, so it’s kind of pointless. Maybe, we’ll see an adjustment tonight? Wishful thinking?
"They say that nobody is perfect. Then they tell you practice makes perfect. I wish they'd make up their minds." - Wilt Chamberlain
I agree with this.
Reid’s (incredibly fat) ship has sailed. He’s done what he can do and it is time to move on.
"Right now Winston Justice is the guy...until that person gets back out there"
FYI...
Minnesota “runs” the WCO.
Andy Reid has to live with Sunday's reality: He was out coached by Tom Cable. (John Clayton)
Since 2005: Andy Reid 36-32-1; 7-25-1 when tied or losing at halftime.
by Route36 on Oct 26, 2009 5:35 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
The WCO is not meant for just passing. Mike Holmgren was successful running the ball with Shawn Alexander and Minnesota is succesful with AP and Taylor running 30+ times per game. WCO offense is more dangerous if you have a running game.
Andy Reid has to live with Sunday's reality: He was out coached by Tom Cable. (John Clayton)
Since 2005: Andy Reid 36-32-1; 7-25-1 when tied or losing at halftime.
by Route36 on Oct 26, 2009 6:49 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
F IT… WE’RE WINNING ANYWAY!!
I don’t care what kind of fan you are… either way you’ll probably piss me off at some point regardless… as long as we are all reaching for the same common goal – TO WIN!
So we better win tonight. Last year at FedEx, I had to sit next to a bunch of fat jamaicans while my friends were in a completely different section then me… not only did these guys talk shit the entire time but they harrassed me for the entire game! Then to have to walk back to the car completely miserable… lets hope tonight will be a completely different outcome!
In life, as in a football game, the principle to follow is: Hit the line hard.
-Theodore Roosevelt
I don't think
A fair weather fan would take the time out of their day to actually have a voice about the team on here. So it think its pretty safe to say that very little or no one is a fair weather fan on here though. I could be wrong though.
If you is, get the hell off the site and quit wasting your and our time.
THANK YOU JALARSEN FOR THIS POST!
HEY LOOK IM POSTING IN ALL CAPS!!!!!HAHAHAHAH alright im sorry that was just funny to me. Yes we as fans we are Allowed to criticize a player, in the end its the team we support …not the individual( although im pulling for cunningham to come aoutta retirement….WHAT?!!!! HE CAN STILL GET THE JOB DONE!!!!)
You dont like my IGGLES???!!!! well you can just suck my VICK!
Rec'd
Very much agree on your definition of a fair weather fan. The fact that we’re all here talking Eagles proves we are not fair weather. I’m willing to bet pretty much of all us do whatever we can to watch every single Eagles game. I know I do.
by Rumplestiltskin02 on Oct 26, 2009 6:18 PM EDT reply actions
So you know how many different excuses I've had to use
to keep getting off of work on Sundays
"What did it feel like? That collision, I didn't feel nothing, because he was pretty much defenseless. It was like running through a cardboard box. Seriously. Cardboard box."- Sheldon Brown on his pounding of Reggie Bush in the '06 Playoffs
"DO" you know...
"What did it feel like? That collision, I didn't feel nothing, because he was pretty much defenseless. It was like running through a cardboard box. Seriously. Cardboard box."- Sheldon Brown on his pounding of Reggie Bush in the '06 Playoffs
Rooting for them when they win and calling for their heads the second they falter the tiniest amount is what’s stupid and what I have a problem with 80% of the people on this site.
I am the people's troll :3™
Getting beat by Oakland...
…hardly counts as “faltering the tiniest amount.”
"Right now Winston Justice is the guy...until that person gets back out there"
Great post man....
Proud to be an Eagles fan!
by Eagles need to run on Oct 26, 2009 9:31 PM EDT reply actions
Welcome to the internet, where 32 is ancient and you can’t win a championship unless you’ve already won a championship.
I am the people's troll :3™
You're right
The idiots, and I won’t name names (cough cough Joe_D and toofunny777) are the ones who call McNabb absolutely useless and a loser and say he was never good for anything.
There will be a day when Kolb is the best option at qb for us. If you believe that day is today, you have a right to your opinion. However, that does not discount everything McNabb has done for the team. Aaron Rodgers became the best option for the Packers when they kicked Favre out the door; did Green Bay fans deride Favre (granted he won a Super Bowl, but McNabb has had almost the same level of success)? If you think McNabb is a loser, a poor player, etc. then you should go to Jerry Jones’ suite and get on your knees because we don’t need you around here.
Good Post, honest, and rational
Some people act as if the Eagles will plunge into the pit of hell and destruction the day McNabb is not our QB. Others act as if we’d be in a Golden Age already if we had only gotten rid of him 2 years ago. I obviously don’t think either of these opinions are very rational.
McNabb has been great, and you can’t take that away from him. But we are approaching the day when he will no longer be the best option…and people are going to come along to that idea at their own pace.
For me…I’m almost ready to turn the page…ALMOST…I want to see how he and the offense do against the Giants and Dallas. If he pulls it out, he’s my man moving forward. If our offense sputters with dirt-balls, and we lose these…I’m ready for something else.
"What did it feel like? That collision, I didn't feel nothing, because he was pretty much defenseless. It was like running through a cardboard box. Seriously. Cardboard box."- Sheldon Brown on his pounding of Reggie Bush in the '06 Playoffs
for me he's got 2 more years( tops!) to get it done or leave
He’s got the O weapons….the D will be mended and fierce, other than that i’d say point well taken
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Shutdown Corner - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
- Giants to be honored with commemorative NY license plate; some would rather see a 9/11 plate
- The hidden play of Super Bowl XLVI: Justin Tuck’s third-quarter sack
- Report: Chad Ochocinco will become Chad Johnson once again
- Video: Bill Belichick implores his defense to make the Giants throw to Mario Manningham
- Training Day: Learning the 40 with an Olympian
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
