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Mcnabb vs Elway

Does anybody remember when John Elway was going through the same shit that Mcnabb is going through?I was really small but I can recall Dan Reeves being the coach and he was talking about letting Elway go, and they even drafted Tommy Maddox in 1992 in the 1st round! What happened? Maddox shared time with Elway in 1992, played in 13 games and had less than 1000 YD's passing! Tommy Maddox came out of UCLA, he was drafted Higher than Kevin Kolb and didn't endup being the replacement. Why did the Bronco's want to replace Elway? Agian I was 9 years old but I think they said that he played on the edge, Throwing to many INT's and forcing too much. Looking at Elway's stats we will compare him to Mcnabb. It shows that Elway throws tons more INT's than MCnabb.

Hall of Famer John Elway's First 10 Years

  Passing                  
Year  COMP  ATT  PCT   YDS    Y/A   TD INT
1983  123   259  47.5  1663   6.4   7  14
1984  214   380  56.3  2598   6.8  18  15
1985  327   605  54.0  3891   6.4  22  23
1986  280   504  55.6  3485   6.9  19  13
1987  224   410  54.6  3198   7.8  19  12
1988  274   496  55.2  3309   6.7  17  19
1989  223   416  53.6  3051   7.3  18  18
1990  294   502  58.6  3526   7.0  15  14
1991  242   451  53.7  3253   7.2  13  12
1992  174   316  55.1  2242   7.1  10  17
*Tommy Maddox Drafted for replacement

Donovan Mcnabb
Passing
Year   Comp  ATT  PCT    YD    Y/A  TD INT
1999   106   216  49.1   948   4.4   8   7
2000   330   569  58.0  3365   5.9  21  13
2001   285   493  57.8  3233   6.6  25  12
2002   211   361  58.4  2289   6.3  17   6
2003   275   478  57.5  3216   6.7  16  11
2004   300   469  64.0  3875   8.3  31   8
2005   211   357  59.1  2507   7.0  16   9
2006   180   316  57.0  2647   8.4  18   6
2007   195   326  59.8  2329   7.1  13   6

I'm not a huge stat guy but you guy's love them. So the only thing I can say is that Mcnabb has less YDS, Ints and His TD's are right there.

  I guess alot of people forget this about Elway. He took them to the Superbowl and lost to the Dynasty team in the 1980's that nobody beat the Niners w/(Joe"Cool"Montana). I think everyone would agree that we have a dynasty team that beat us and keeps winning the Pats w/(Tom"Cool"Brady). I really don't understand what local writers, Local Fans, WIP and natonal media is talking about. Mcnabb is having a bad year. Period. Our team isn't all that any way as we have learned. But QB's Like Elway, Farve, Cunningham, Gannon, Chandler, Brees, etc.. have come back from adversity and have played the at the highest level. I think when you think of them specific QB's I think of the skill players that they had. Elway had Smith, Mccaffterty, Sharpe, Davis. Farve has a bunch of young play makers finally. Cunnningham had Moss, Carter, Smith, Gannon had Rice, Porter, Brown. Chandler had Mathis, Dwight, Santiago, Anderson
Brees had Henderson, Bush, Colston, Copper and Horn.

Ok here's a real question? Who do we have to help Mcnabb? For real? It's not a whole lot. We have to get more players to help him. What would happen if we drop Mcnabb and go with Kolb? Kolb prolly will not have the same group of skill players so comparing will be tuff. We know that most Qb's don't make it to Mcnabb's level. Next year I will be shocked if we have such a weak offense. Brown and Curtis are great complemetry players we need to upgrade at TE and WR. This can happen too. This isn't baseball like Andrew reminded us that teams go from worst to first all the time!

Lastly in my last rant I said that we like blue collar, screamer types. We do. Mcnabb is himself and no one can change that. I think to myself what would happen if a city asked me to be cool calm type guy knowing that I'm a screamer. I couldn't change what I was so why would we ask MCnabb to do the same.Ask yourself the same question. The bottom line is John Elway had the same shit happen to him Minus the injuries, he took his team to the Superbowl and lost. He got help from his GM to get him playmakers and he rallied his career to end up with 2 superbowls. Why? Because he was a above average QB (with and this is important) playmakers surrounding him. We need to do them same.

What do you guy's think?

0 recs  |  Comment 8 comments

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The difference I see
This is a big one too. I don't remember Elway having so many season ending injuries and major offseason surgeries.

by JasonB on Dec 10, 2007 12:37 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

After 1992.
Elway had a lot of good things happen around him after 1992 that allowed him to elevate his play.

1993 - Shannon Sharpe becomes All-Pro tight end in his 4th year.  Elway throws over 4000 yards and for 25 TD's for the first time.  Remains near this level the rest of his career.  Jason Elam drafted.  Gary Zimmerman obtained in free agency.
1994 - Wideout Anthony Miller obtained in free agency.  Tom Nalen drafted.
1995 - Shanahan hired.  Terrell Davis drafted. Rod Smith discovered as undrafted free agent.  Mark Schlereth obtained in free agency.

Lets see.  1) O-line dramatically improved.  2) Top-3 all-time tight end of all time emerges.  4) Great new kicker obtained.  5) Two really good wideouts obtained.  6) Top-10 new coach hired.  7) One of the great all time draft steals occurs with Terrell Davis, a top-10 all-time runningback.

Elway's injuries mostly came later in his career and they weren't season ending IIRC.

by Andrew on Dec 11, 2007 11:15 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Reflecting my points,
#1 What I have been saying all season about playmakers.

"Lets see.  1) O-line dramatically improved.  2) Top-3 all-time tight end of all time emerges.  4) Great new kicker obtained.  5) Two really good wideouts obtained.  6) Top-10 new coach hired.  7) One of the great all time draft steals occurs with Terrell Davis, a top-10 all-time runningback."

This is what a great GM could do for us. Like it or not Bill Polian looks and acts like a GM and Tony Dungy Looks and acts like a Coach. Man I wish we could have this situation in Eagle Land. Reid is your boy and all, I can understand that. But, THings should be "dumbed down" and I would think that less pressure on the Coach could help.

#2

I was trying to make people understand that Mcnabb isn't finished. Some fans think he is like on Alex Smith's level or something. I don't really understand all the trade and Kolb alk so I wanted to remind them that Elway wasn't always and Hall of fame QB. And you totally showed why. Improved team around him. If you improve the team around a QB it makes them look and play better. Look at Brady. Who would have thought that he would break Manning's TD pass record? Maybe Randy Moss helped him out a little? I dunno?

by topcat6 on Dec 12, 2007 2:32 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

It's difficult for McNabb
to have as many INTs as Elway did when he keeps throwing the ball into the ground.  How many times have we seen him make awful-looking throws that hit the ground 5 yards short of a receiver?  It used to be he'd throw it where nobody except his receiver could (maybe) get to it, and surely not anybody on the other team.  Now, with the exception of the 3 perfect strikes to the Pats LB, he seems to throw it where nobody on either team can get to it.
"Giving up a 97-yard drive with less than 2 minutes to Brian Fucking Griese is one of the most epic collapses you will ever see." - sdf

by Bo Diddle on Dec 13, 2007 1:53 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Just curious...
What game are you talking about?  McNabb didn't play against the Pats, nor did he play against the Seahawks, from which the "three perfect strikes to a LB" reference came from.
2007 Philadelphia Eagles -- Thanks for the terrible memories!

by BrianS on Dec 13, 2007 2:29 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Wow
What are you talking about? Does he throw every pass into the dirt? Does he miss every open WR? Would you rather him just say F@@E$ it and let it go like Farve, Grossman, Elway, Carr, or be predetermend like AJ Feely. Ohh your solution is a kid on the sideline. Ok, I just thought that we were going to hear something productive. Nevermind.

by topcat6 on Dec 13, 2007 5:51 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Completions
McNabb actually has a higher completion percentage than Feeley.  I guess Feeley's bad passes are "prettier".

by Andrew on Dec 13, 2007 7:36 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Holy Ravioli, Batman
Did I post that?  Must have been a really stressful day at work.  I admit I was trolling a bit but the point I was making, and quite poorly at that, was McNabbb doesn't get INTs like Elway did because he is, or was, willing to throw it into the ground rather than force a throw, at the risk of looking horrible, which many times it does.  I certainly would rather see the ball on the ground than an INT, but those grounders sure look ugly.

The three perfect strikes line was a cut-and-paste error (I was hallucinating...maybe it was that  pic of Wade Phillips' daughter that caused it) where I was thinking the same thing as what topcat posted about chucking it out there but somehow screwed up my typing.  No, I'd rather see McNabb than Feeley.

As for the kid on the sideline, sure, I'd like to see him take some snaps, but I believe McNabb needs to play through, and hopefully out of, his current funk, and should be given however many snaps it takes to do so until it's obvious he is or isn't going to return to form.    

"Giving up a 97-yard drive with less than 2 minutes to Brian Fucking Griese is one of the most epic collapses you will ever see." - sdf

by Bo Diddle on Dec 13, 2007 10:47 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

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